“People want something new”: The Claude Moraes interview

Claude Moraes is a Member of the European Parliament for London. This interview with Alex Smith was conducted by telephone and email in the week of July 27th.

In the past six weeks we’ve had three elections – for the European Parliament, the local councils and now the Norwich North by-election – and in each one Labour has been badly defeated. Being so involved in the party but not in domestic politics, it would be interesting to hear your perspective on why things are going so wrong..?
Labour MEPs in a regional PR system work very hard across whole regions now, and get a good feel for what is happening on the ground politically in our regions. We are always represented at by elections – Norwich included. The lessons for Labour of Norwich are serious ones, but there has to be an acknowledgement of the unusual circumstances of this by election – it’s unfair to ignore that. Having said that, the result clearly showed underlying problems in our support – ranging from the tough situation of being in power for 12 years, the recession, and the way the expenses scandal impacted on Labour in particular. Our response as a Party though cannot be to just accept these substantial problems in our support, but to renew our narrative – give people reasons to vote Labour. It will not be enough to repeat our achievements in office – people want something new. We are competing with the Tory message of change – even if the substance behind their message is very poor on policy or any new effective direction on the economy.

Why do cabinet ministers go on the TV and radio and say that this doesn’t constitute a huge failing on behalf of our party? Either it’s completely disingenuous – and that does us no favours – or worryingly blind to the scale of the uphill battle we face in the next year.
In a 24 hour media world, any cabinet minister is going to say that the by election result was disappointing and that the government is doing a good job – any sign of nuance and they will be taken apart. A good exception was Peter Mandelson’s interview on Newsnight. He talked about renewing the message and dividing lines with the Tories, while, as you would expect defending the government’s recent action on jobs and the economy. There was more nuance and taking the fight to the Tories, which I expect we will see more of in the Conference period and Glasgow by-election.

So what can be done to change the situation for the party? Is there enough time for Gordon Brown to turn things around?
I’ve never seen a more volatile, unpredictable time in UK politics. While the Tories are clearly ahead in the polls, I’m pretty sure that the private view in their Party after Norwich was one of relief rather than triumph. Why? They know that they will be scrutinised in the coming weeks – particularly the inexperienced shadow chancellor, when they are not hitting the kind of poll ratings Labour routinely achieved before 1997. If the Tories are following the Labour war book of that period, then they know they have yet to seal the deal with the British public. Labour has a mountain to climb, but it is possible to do it, if we renew our message and expose the Tories’ inexperience and their plans for a more unequal society – their recent antics in the European Parliament suggest a darker side. We need more debate on what they would actually do in power.

You were Labour’s spokesperson on employment in the European Parliament. What does that role entail and how is Labour working to protect British employment interests?
Going into the new European Parliament, I was elected Deputy Leader of the Labour MEPs in Europe, and I’m spokesperson on Citizen’s Rights, Justice and Home Affairs – I’m seeking election to be spokesperson in this area for the new Socialist and Democrat Group in the European Parliament in September. Part of what MEPs do now as opposed to the 1980s and most of the 1990s is work on legislation in key areas like the environment and climate change, the internal market and employment laws. There are potentially increasing powers in areas like justice and cross border security, and there will be more of that, particularly if Lisbon is ratified. This means that whether you are a Euro sceptic or pro-European, there should be engagement in the UK about what we do and clear communication from us. The political debate should not just be about the UK centric for or against Europe – but that there is a left and right within the EU on every piece of legislation. And there is a genuine debate on whether we need EU legislation in some areas and not others. Where the EU works, is where a national solution is not possible or net enough. Obvious examples include better regulation of the internal market or improvement of workers rights in an age of multinational power. My constituency London has more agency workers than any city in the EU, the UK more than any other EU country. The EU will give those workers – some of whom are vulnerable – basic rights. Flexibility in our Labour market is maintained but new transnational rights help workers employed in new ways. One of the problems with positive changes from the EU – common rules which help UK business trade more easily – or monopoly breaking rules which stop rip off prices for consumers are rarely credited while the myths of an overbearing EU bureaucracy just multiply in the UK.

So are “British jobs for British workers” possible? What does that phrase mean to you?
A statement which was supposed to be about training more British workers to be able to access more skilled jobs has become a slogan for the BNP, and incidents like those at the Linley oil refinery illustrate why it is important to close loopholes which create potential unfairness in the free movement of workers. So the Posted Workers Directive needs revision after the ECJ deemed that the right of trade unions to organise and negotiate collective agreements was outstripped by the right of establishment. Two-tier workforces are unacceptable, and free movement only works if there is equal access to jobs for all EU workers.

You were yourself an immigrant to Britain and you’ve written about the politics of migration. How should Labour be framing the case for immigration in order to win back some of the million voters who shunned the party last month in favour of the BNP and other groups?
Labour needs to continue making the positive case for migration, but it must be done hand in hand with the promotion of effective integration policies and a clear understanding of how immigration impacts on particular Community. A clear understanding of how issues like affordable housing fit into the immigration debate are also essential.

This will be the last LabourList interview until the Conference season.

Related posts:

1. Claude Moraes wins Krishna Menon award
2. People don’t understand why I’d want to be a councillor – but I’m proud of our young people in Lambeth
3. The Neal Lawson interview
4. The Martin Bell interview
5. The Iain Dale interview