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Let there be discontent

January 8, 2012 3:54 pm

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“Are we too unkind to Ed?” pondered David Talbot, on this very website, only two days ago. Meanwhile, as Political Scrapbook covered Blackbustersgate, it was noted that “Poor Ed” has had “one of those weeks”.

Even before Abbottgate (which, without wanting to generalise, sounds like the kind of place white people would live), it had been decided this was a bad week for Ed Miliband. From there, it only got worse. Definitely “one of those weeks”. The problem is, “one of those weeks” is starting to feel like the standard. When won’t it be one of these weeks, I wonder?

Writing “Blackbusters” instead of “Blockbusters” could have happened to anyone (and Muphry’s Law ensured that we were temporarily trapped in a vicious circle of spelling errors), but when it happened, it felt sadly predictable that it would be on Miliband’s feed. It is, unfortunately, exactly the kind of thing that would happen to him. He is a bad luck magnet. Negative press gravitates towards him. Often seemingly out of nowhere, each new story hurtles into his face like an asteroid, causing yet another awkward photo.

Every time he speaks he seems to upset someone. Every time a shadow cabinet member says anything, even if it’s something Ed Miliband agrees with, it’s a Blairite plot. Trade Union leaders don’t seem to like him much anymore. The newspapers never did. There are even manoeuvres to get rid of him in order to replace him with his brother in five years time, apparently.

As Mark Ferguson pointed out, everything that anyone does or says is viewed through the prism of attacking or backing Ed Miliband. For many Labour loyalists, it seems the prism is even smaller: he’s always under attack. It’s him against the world and, no matter how many times he tells the Guardian he’s a man of grit and steel, he can’t take on the world. Just look at him.

Here lies a problem. We’re not being too unkind to poor Ed; we’re starting to pity him.

This is a dangerous situation to be in. People back Ed because they think no one else is. Standing up for people who can’t stand up for themselves in itself, this is no bad thing. It’s what makes us who we are as a Party. It’s what helps define us and to me, it’s a sign of compassion. But two years ago it left us rallying around a leader who was vilified in the press daily and couldn’t connect with the electorate. It was the same backs up against the wall, Us vs The World attitude. Letting Ed go the same way would do no one favours. Saying “Game on” ad infinitum is not a strategy for victory.

Let’s not jump on anyone who isn’t being unfailingly nice about Miliband. Let’s not attack the three Labour MPs today who have hardly said the most controversial things about his leadership. Everyone who points out that the last week has not gone well is not an enemy. Everyone who thinks the past year has not gone well is not an enemy. If you don’t let people be critical friends, then they just stop being friends.

Let there be discontent. It’ll help us, honest.

  • Johndclare

    The problem is this; where does constructive criticism end, and disloyalty start?

    • Anonymous

      I see Miliband and a few others have been running to the Mail again talking about welfare, the Mail is now the Barometer of what socialist  think.

      The problem for labour it’s not labour, it’s not socialist it has no socialism left, most of the people in labour including the leaders are mostly upper middle class, and Miliband can be classed as being upper class rich.

      Most MP’s come into power/ Politics  to get a second house, flog it off make a pile buy another do the same again end up with a million quid home, save your wages live off your expenses sent the kids through private education and live a really good life.

      Then tell people who have worked down the coal mines steel works or building sites you have never had it so good, so work another four or five years before getting a state pension.

      Question why would anyone vote Labour knowing they only get a second rate Cameron.

  • Anonymous

    If you’ve got a beef about Labour policy have a word with Liam Byrne and leave Ed Miliband alone. Miliband is Byrne’s sock puppet these days don’t you know?

  • Anonymous

    To twitter or not to twitter, that is the question, answer if your Abbott and Miliband best to keep clear.

    But the question many people are asking  is the same one a lot of people ask, perhaps Miliband would like to answer it, what is labour, where is it going, who it’s target voter.

    If it keeps on following the Tories and agreeing with it people will think well ok better to vote for the real thing not the copy, and it would be nice to know what labour feels about education, NHS, welfare, social housing.  Also what is the difference between New labour and Newer labour.

  • Anonymous

    Sorry Conor, much as I really enjoy your writing, I disagree completely with your premise here.

    It is all a matter of interpretation, and this to me is becoming a bit of a
    media/internal factionalist bandwagon.

    I also think it completely detracts from the vital tasks ahead for Labour,
    and plays into the hands of detractors and lets others off the hook.

    I have absoloutely no problem with constructive criticism or healthy debate, but I don’t think that’s what we’ve seen in recent week; it looks more like ganging up, and other agendas/
    power struggles at play as sub text.

    I also intensely dislike seeing personal attacks on any individual, especially
    when the implications are so profound.(I’m referring to the raft of sniping articles
    amongst some of the more right wing of the party, eg ex ministers, and what appear to be
    journalist allies with a very specific agenda.)

    Does any of this involve the public, or the bigger issues at stake that affect us all?

    I’d much prefer to see a level playing field, fair play, and balanced constructive debate;
    reaching out, not going inwards and being self destructive as a party.

    I can only comment from where I’m standing; but I think all this stuff swirling around
    can become a self fulfilling prophecy; the media just reinforces itself instead of questioning
    and seeking wider views.

    I do not refer to LL, although I’ve been disappointed of late with some of the headlines and emphasis, despite the fact many brilliant articles continue.

    I hope there is room for all views to air, in the spirit of good faith and genuine debate.

    Thankyou. Jo.

    • GuyM

      When everyone walks into a polling station in May 2015 it will also come down to “intepretation”.

      You can’t expect members of your party who don’t like or agree with Milliband to stay silent when he is clearly so ineffective.

      Your parliamentary party wanted someone else, your members wanted someone else….. he is there only due to a block union vote.

      If you honestly think the knocking about of Milliband in the press and within your own party is going to stop, then your being very naive.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Mike-Homfray/510980099 Mike Homfray

        Wrong. There is no block union vote. All of those votes were individually cast by associate members .

        There is a debate to be had as to whether there should be a OMOV system, but given that Labour does incorporate the unions within its structures, there would still have to be a place for union affiliates

        However, in terms of the number of actual votes cast, the majority were for Ed Miliband 

      • Anonymous

        I’ve just been listening to “What the Papers say” on R4,
        and the general view seems to be that the trivial outburst over the
        typo on Twitter was led by the 2 Murdoch papers- Sun and Times.
        Completely predictable.

        On “Westminster Hour” R4, I caught some of the views from
        more expert opinion, and an experienced academic, presumably
        in politics- said that in his view there had been a great deal of
        “fuss and noise” within the Westminster bubble/media outlets,
        but little that “actually cut through to the public”over the Xmas period.
        The real tasks ahead will be of importance.

        What was significant of course, was last week’s verdict of the SL
        trial; unfortunately news seemed to have got somewhat hijacked
        by a “media storm” which distracted attention elsewhere.
        I think that was very wrong.
        Excellent debate on “race” though in the Indy on Sunday today;
        also Observer; yesterday on LL- well timed in retrospect.

        We are still relatively in the early stages, and still many factors
        which could change over time on the political landscape.

        I heard some other interesting factors discussed on the
        “Westminster Hour” which don’t often seem to be aired.
        It was about strengths and weaknesses of the coalition
        arrangement, and the Tory party.
        (Mostly from Nick W of Guardian I think.)

        For example, a reminder that DC is leading a minority
        government; the LD’s are likely to fare extremely badly
        at the next local elections(?);virtually half of Tory MP’s
        are new 2010 intake, and apparently marked rebellious
        and ambitious individuals amongst them- also a strong
        streak of Euroscepticism, which might demand far more
        concessions on Europe; this could escalate tensions within 
        the party and esp the LD’s?
        Many of them apparently feel very resentful about
        election outcome, and may blame DC for style of campaign?

        I think it was said the Tories still have a big image problem,
        and are still striving to “broaden appeal.”
        So on the one hand, they may be popular for doing
        “tough” things; on the other, need to appear more
        modern and liberal?

        It was also stated, a question of what the role of the
        LD’s actually is, and how much sway; and how
        the backbenchers will be appeased…..

        Meanwhile, Labour of course has its own dynamics
        and power struggles to be dealing with;
        I’d say bound to be a difficult and challenging time;
        post 13 years of New Lab in govt; post 2008
        global financial crisis;new leader in relatively early stage
        of role; factional power struggles reminiscent of the
        “Blair/Brown” era…..also possibly less funding,
        so far more challenging.

        This is why I believe it is necessary to build a wider base
        and take a more pluralist approach; use the existing resources
        we have in the party, and that is strong, grassroots upwards.
        Build closer bridges with the public and supporters;
        use the energy and creativity of people’s ideas along the way.

        With regard to role of opposition, that needs to be robust,
        clear and strong; especially on the big issues like
        economy, NHS, education, employment, welfare,
        enviroment.

        Policy development and direction- extremely proactive,
        much clearer; applying democratic process to testing of ideas;
        wider outlook; seeking allies and expertise.

        What will hamper all of this though is if people
        are not working together and splitting off
        in all directions; hatching plots etc.

        I think they need to remember the public are watching,
        waiting and hoping for some kind of radical reshaping
        of how politics is done in this country;
        and Labour has an opportunity to set out a new path
        above and beyond what has happened in the past
        or what we are seeing now.

        The danger will be if it just defines itself in the shadow
        of right wing politics and an agenda set by others;
        we should be formulating an independent and alternative path.

        Perhaps too it all needs to be more “people” orientated;
        less of an internalized bubble.

        Anything can happen between now and 2015, if not before,
        and all to play for.

        Thanks, Jo.

        • GuyM

          I think you are living ni your own fantsy world to be honest Jo.

          There is zero chance of a coalition split before 2015 unless it is in the clear interests of the partners for it to happen… and it won’t be.

          If it is going badly, leaving will be electoral suicide, it is going well then why stop a good thing.

          you say the tories have a “minority government” yet polled more than Blair in 2005 i.e. the electoral system is skewed, that will be fixed, so expect a 37% to 28% vote next time if it occurs to lead to a Tory majority.

          The playing field is being levelled, have fun with that.

          As to your fixation with experts…. whose experts are they? Not mine, I didn’t appoint them and neither did the public. Some person who has aposition in some quango etc. means nothing to me at all.

          The idea that I go againt my own views and analysis on the basis of “experts” is frankly hilarious.

          But then I regard managment by “concensus” and “committees2 to be a waste of time.

          Milliband didn’t get the support of members or MPs, they are not obliged to keep quiet or stay loyal….so best get used to dissent.

          • Anonymous

            I think I’m wasting my time in responding to your comments
            Guy or attempting to explain, for the umpteenth time.

            As stated very clearly, I was floating ideas and possible scenarios, taking into account variable factors; it is a nuanced picture.

            That was reflected as put forward in debate on the “Westminster Hour;” as I understand it, one was a senior editor at the Guardian, the other a professor (?of politics)
            at a prominent university.
            So compared to a lay person to politics, probably “expert”
            in analysis.

            So, far from “fantasy” politics-it’s simply analysis and opinion,
            based on some known factors, which is all any of us can do.
            Politics is not an exact science, but more about human behaviour, something of which we all have powers of observation and experience to draw upon.

            I’d like to leave it at that Guy, because you have a habit of addressing people in an incredibly rude way when you don’t happen to agree with opinion; and pure polemics is not advancing any kind of debate.

            Jo

          • GuyM

            Why on earth would I or anyone else automatically regard an editor of the Guardian or a University professor of politics as being more likely to be right than anyone else on political policy?

            I’d expect the Guardian Editor to be a good source for information on how to run a national newspaper. I expect the Professor to be a good source on teaching political theory, ideology and history.

            But I wouldn’t accept that either were de facto better than anyone else to shape political policy.

            Nor would I assume they were “expert” in analysis. I’ve recruited a lot of market analysts and business analysts, I was a market analyst…… these people are experienced “analysts”, not a newspaper editor.

            Also Jo I have a habit of adressing people in a frank and forthright way, I don’t do nicey nicey, if you can’t handle robust discussion then ok, but don’t go blaming me for that.

            I’m largely of the centre right, you are largely of the left /centre left…… it isn’t going to be polite and friendly.

          • Anonymous

            Look Guy, please stop dragging this out.
            I explained my comments clearly in original post, it is you who seems to be adding something different.

            And as for the way you address people, sometimes OK- but other times appear provocative.I saw you saying the other day something about “despising” Peter J, which you seem to think is “robust.” It is not- it is personally directed and attacking people themselves rather than than their views.No one is entitled to do that; it’s basic common sense.

            You have said before you have libertarian views, which is fine- but please remember this is a Labour minded site, and as such its main focus is exploring Labour process.

            I do not want to have to respond constantly over so many posts Guy; it makes dialogue difficult and probably boring for other people to read when trying to follow points of debate.

            I suggest you just offer your own contributions Guy to original article, instead of constantly seeking to counter other people’s opinions for the sake of it.

            I respect your right of opinion, as anyone else here.

            J

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Mike-Homfray/510980099 Mike Homfray

            I very occasionally reply to Guy but only to correct factual errors. I don’t actually care about him nor his daft views which have no place here

          • Anonymous

            Thanks Mike, I’ve been taking some time to try and have a discussion, but there are limits to my time.

            Hope all is well with you!

            Jo

    • Conor Pope

      Hi Jo,

      I’m sorry that we disagree on the premise here. It is, as you say, down to interpretation. Looking at the coverage the Party get and at Miliband’s personal polling, I’m very worried that we’re heading down a blind alley electorally. I think Ed can turn it around, but he’s not doing a great job at keeping his friends on side – I thought Gus Baker’s piece the other day was excellent http://labourlist.org/2012/01/labours-plan-a-has-failed/

      Thanks for the comments on all my pieces, I always keep a look out for them! And agree on Steve Richards, an excellent commentator!

      • Anonymous

        Hi Conor, just found your reply- thankyou.

        I agree there has been a real feeling of impasse and confusion at times,
        but in between some very good speeches, and the start of Refounding Labour rolled out, which I attended one of the policy forums over a day.
        It’s been too long since then, and I don’t understand why process has appeared so long and drawn out.

        I fully acknowledge a lot of people have genuine concerns, including me to be honest- but what I don’t agree with is the “anti Ed” thing being played out
        by what appears to be some of the right wing of the party, and expressed so negatively and forcefully via tabolid channels?

        It just looks like “jumping the gun”without checking the full state of play or having a wider discussion amongst members and public supporters/grassroots etc; this should be about all sections of the party in democratic process I think.

        I’m not in any way an “insider” to knowledge about the party, so my outlook and experience is limited with regard to party politics, but I do think we can all take a view and share impressions of process over time.

        I think there is real potential for massive creative collaboration and shared ideas during this time, and I would agree the party could be doing far more to bring people in and follow up where they started last spring.

        I’d guess that there are many things happening concurrently, and it may have been rather overwhelming.

        But they must keep their eye on the ball as to where the priorities lie.

        So I’d really like to see all ideas shared Conor; I’m sure there is far more common ground out there than stark differences.

        The “grassroots” articles on LL have really inspired me over time, as did the people’s policy forum last year; but I’d also like see balance of opinion across the whole media, and a level playing field.

        I realise also time is of the essence- but I do believe much more will become clearer this year, and then people will be in a better position to judge/make choices.

        There are other factors and pressures at play also, which other new leaders of parties have not had to contend with; I think credit must be given where its due- but also never to be complacent or merely sit on the fence- I’d agree.

        Hope this makes some sense; they are just my immediate thoughts.

        Yes, too, one can find some excellent analysis out there- my favourites
        are P.Toynbee, S.Richards,J.Ashley, and that very good female columnist in the T’graph; her name escapes me for now.
        Also many at the BBC- but not all…..C4 news/research;
        documentaries on BBC 4; R4- some wonderful stuff out there.
        But it’s all the “gossip” I can’t stand.

        It could be an interesting time to open up the airwaves Conor,
        and get far more people on board; I like what Compass are doing very much, for example, but also inspired by the Co Op movement, and would like to see big public debates.

        Hope you are enjoying the writing too, and good luck with your campaigning;
        I’m not quite sure of your involvement in the party or politics in general?

        Always enjoy reading your perspective on things Conor-
        you’ve written some of the best articles on LL in my view.

        Thankyou, Jo.

  • AmberStar

    Ed Miliband may be sanguine about the situation but even his most ardent supporters know: He has about 6 months before things could turn very nasty indeed. If Ken doesn’t win London &/or Labour fails to make significant gains in the 2012 local elections, then it will take a miraculous piece of good luck to save his leadership.

    On the other hand, if Ken wins London &/or Labour do better than expected in the locals, then he can shrug off all the negative press as the expected consequence of taking on Murdoch & other Vested Interests.

    I speak as somebody who supports Ed & I am fervently hoping that things go well for him.

  • Anonymous

    “and Murphy’s Law ensured that we were temporarily trapped in a vicious circle of spelling errors”

    Making a spelling error while criticising someone else’s spelling error is in fact known as Muphry’s Law. The vicious circle keeps turning.

  • Anonymous

    Conor, with “friends” like you and Richards and Rentoul, Ed Miliband doesn’t need enemies.

    The ridiculous story about the misspelling of a long defunct TV programme that I dare say others, like myself, had never heard of, isn’t a “story” at all.

    We all make mistakes, silly stupid mistakes, but there is no malice aforethought.

    I said right at the start of the week in regard to a column written by a Councillor on LL that in my view “Twitter” is a waste of time, which suggests people are vain enough to think everyone else is interested in their most minute thoughts and details, but that said, typing an “a” instead of an “o” is a far less grevious sin than aiding and abetting the war in Iraq, or Gordon Brown rehabilitating Mandelson, so he could become more pompous than ever, or tax dodging or expenses fiddling.

    Ed Miliband is innocent of all these things. What on earth possessed you to drag up a story which has been relished by Labour’s enemies int he press and even on this site, and which really is now a togtally dead story. Yesterdays – I was going to say news, but it wasn’t even that – just a stupid piece of tittle-tattle.

    • Anonymous

      But it’s tittle tattle which need not have happened, I doubt Miliband has ever heard of the show blockbuster or the presenter, but of course it a means of showing your normal your up with play  your with the people. and bang it all goes wrong.

    • GuyM

      Funny how you get quite strident in attacking me over a “nothing” story, despite me saying clearly that it was important due to the comic timing that reinforced the image of Milliband, when a LL post mentions it, the press mention it and the net is awash with sarcastic comments about it.

      I’d agree with your views on twitter, but sadly despite being the leader of HM opposition, Ed M clearly thinks he has such a low recognition that he needs to “get down with” social media. I suspect he is trying to somehow replicate Obama’s use of the media channel, without any idea of context.

      By the way, I’m still trying to grasp how you can type an a instead of an o and claim it was a typo……

      • Anonymous

        “By the way, I’m still trying to grasp how you can type an a instead of an o and claim it was a typo……”

        That’s because you’re concentrating on the separation of the letters on the keyboard. Black and block are both valid words in the English language and the Saccadic Vector Maps are similar.

        Given that he was typing this at a time when he was also dealing with Abbott’s Twitter fiasco, the black/block mistake is an entirely reasonable typo.

        Personally, I’m still trying to grasp how you can think that it was deliberate. It’s not like he gained anything by typing “Blackbusters”.

        • GuyM

          I’m not saying it was deliberate, I’m merely saying I can’t see how passing it off as a slip of the fingers is legitimate.

          A mental abberation and I agree, a spell check gone wrong the same.

          A Froidian slip? That would be too funny to contemplate.

    • http://www.facebook.com/matthew.blott Matthew Blott

      Don’t pretend you haven’t heard of Blockbusters. You really are being disingenuous.

      • Anonymous

        Matthew, Reading the newspapers I found out that Blockbusters was an afternoon show for teenagers which ran in the 1980s.

        In the 1980s I was not a teenager and I was working in the afternoons. I had never seen the programme nor heard of it. You may choose not to believe that but it happens to be true. By the same token I have never seen Australian soap operas, even though they still run on British TV, of course I have heard of “Neighbours” because it still exists. Surely I can be forgiven for not knowing of a TV show that ceased transmitting twenty years ago?

  • Anonymous
    • Mike Murray

      Very interesting UK polling report. But for me the most significant fact is that since late December and the beginning of the New Year we have regained our lead in the polls. The Cameron “Veto Bounce” is not being sustained. No wonder the attack dogs are after Ed, digging up spelling mistakes which obviously prove that he is the most dangerous politician since Clement Atlee.

      • GuyM

        If you weren’t ahead nearly two years into a term of office that faces horrible problems I’d be amazed.

        Polls are largely irrelevant until a few weeks before an election.

        • derek

          From a political perspective, I tend to agree with you there Guy, you’ve got to remove the tories early, like the failed Ted Heath government, letting the full term 5 year parliament go through legislation was a massive mistake and no doubt come 2015, there will tax cut a plenty. Devalue Cameron and the troies are easy meat, that’s my advice. 

          • derek

            My advice to Ed, while at the dispatch box and heckling is happening, raise your voice above the heckling, your on the mic and keep going with your points without a break until the chair finally stops the heckling. Practice now! stand up and raise those standards, people count on it.

          • derek

            A little inspiration!!

             I know you’re only protecting yourself 
            I know you’re thinking of evey-body else 
            Someone who made a mess of it all 
            But I’m not about 
            Making up for the Blairites
            We’ve been denying you could ever fill 
            I’m not above doing anything 
            To restore your faith if I can 
            Some people see through the eyes of the old 
            Before they ever get a look at the young 
            I’m only willing to hear you cry out as loud as you can!

  • Mike Murray

    “Negative press gravitates towards him”

    Of course it does. Ed is a left wing  leader of the Labour Party. He has defined the zeitgeist with the squeezed middle and the distinction between predatory and non predatory capitalists. He demanded that bankers’ bonusses be taxed heavily and now Cameron is talking about shareholders limiting pay increases and even the Tories talk of the squeezed middle and crony capitalism. The negative press will only stop when we elect another Blair as our leader. That’s why we should welcome the negative press. It shows that we are heading in the right direction and steadily moving the centre ground leftwards. Who knows, those comrades who are so wedded to the free market might even find the outlawed words “public ownership” re-entering their lexicon.  Now something like that would really get us a negative press. Bring it on.

    “He is a bad luck magnet.”

    As an intellectual argument that is surely worthy of Mystic Meg.

    • GuyM

      The centre is going not in the slightest to the left, it’s just your wishful thinking telling you otherwise.

      2012-12015 will be years of public sector cut backs, private sector growth and eventually tax cuts in time for 2015. If you seriously think the Tory party will support any eftwards movement you are deluded.

      • Mike Murray

        Did I say that Labour needed the support of the Tory party to move to the left?  When we re-define the centre the policies of the  Tories and their Liberal Democrat stoodges will drive the workers into our arms.

        • http://www.facebook.com/matthew.blott Matthew Blott

          Ah, that old dream. Eventually the proles will see the Tory nasties for what they are and will come running so we can create a socialist utopia. Of course this never happened 30 years ago when union membership was far higher as was what used to call the industrial working class but I guess you can dream.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Mike-Homfray/510980099 Mike Homfray

            Well, if our job isn’t to oppose the Tories and present an alternative, we may as well not exist. Politics should not be a choice between two identikit parties

          • Anonymous

            If you see your job as opposing the Tories, then you’re helping to create that false dichotomy.

            Labour should concentrate on forming good policies and only worry about fighting the Tories if they oppose those policies.

            Too often, politicians see their role as fighting the opposition instead of working for their supporters.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Mike-Homfray/510980099 Mike Homfray

            I still think there are clear ideological differences between Labour and Tory. Or at least, should be – don’t buy this ‘take the politics out of politics’ centrist mush

          • Anonymous

            I knew that’s why labour had problem with Nye Bevan he was to the right, the squeezed middle is defined because most of Labour see them selves as the squeezed middle, it was only a year ago labour MP’s were demanding 10% pay rises it was only two years ago they were demanding £100,000 a year  to give up some of their expenses.

            Labours to the left, well then being to the left has changed from my day

        • GuyM

          drive “the workers”……… oh dear, sorry I didn’t realise…

          the SWP (or whatever it calls itself) is in the house.

          power to the people eh wolfie?

          • Mmurray200

            Workers are still workers whether they are on job seekers allowance or not. One doesn’t have to be in the SWP to be a socialist.

          • GuyM

            and people who use “workers” as a sort of militaristic  rallying call don’t have to be in the SWP to be seen as a “certain kind” of socialist (a bit like certain kinds of animal life that died out a few geological periods ago)

          • Mike Murray

            Animals only die out when there is no longer an environment to sustain them.  The environment for socialists is very healthy at the moment.  Which is why the supporters of  Free Market Economics and the dominance of Capital are getting very jittery. A perfect time to start convincing the workers that progressive policies of public ownership (of the utilities for example) would be very much in their interests.

    • Anonymous

      Ed Miliband is your idea of being “Left wing”, Mike?.

      You must be very young….

      • Anonymous

        Sorry Mike, that sounded a bit cruel. I should have enlarged on what I meant.

        If anyone thinks Ed Miliband is “left wing” they had obviously never met  anyone from Militant, or even (before she became respectable), Dawn Primorollo. Even old Blunkett in his salad days on Sheffield council. Now THEY were left wing.

        Ed is never going to become Mick McGahey or Denis Skinner

        • Anonymous

          Or Nye Bevan

        • Mike Murray

          Actually Alan I first voted for Harold Wilson but my ideals have  remained intact.

          • Anonymous

            Hi Mike, Yes I did too – the new society forged in “the white heat of the new technology”. He gave us the Open University, which still exists, and Blair gave us “Cool Brittania” which doesn’t.

            I don’t think Ed will ever be truly left-wing though

  • Daniel Speight

    If you don’t let people be critical friends, then they just stop being friends.

    Really, friends like these, I would hate to see the enemies.

  • Anonymous

    Just a thought, Conor. If you are one of those who want to be rid of Ed Miliband, to get his brother instead:.

    You have to make a silly gaffe which will be plastered over the newspapers. Now, Connor choose one of the two following opitons:

    1) Type: “Black” instead of “Block” (something that would be easy to do and typing errors are made by everybody)

    or

    2) Appear in public gurning, gesticulating with a banana.

    Now I find it very easy to believe Option 1, as I am as guilty of typing errors than anyone, but do you think Option 2 could happen to ANYBODY?

    I warn you, and others who feel the way you do, if you do succeed in replacinmg one Miliband with the other, that photo will come back to haunt you on every front page on numerous occassions.

    Also, Ed Balls will forever be associated (rightly or wrongly) with the failed financial policies of Gordon Brown, and Ms Cooper is known by fewer members of the public than Ed Miliband.

    Despite the fantasies of John Rentoul and Paul Richards et al, Blairism is a thing of the past, so my advice would be to settle down and stick with the leader you’ve got. Look what happened to the Tories when they played musical chairs.

  • Anonymous

    Now the welfare state is dying and who stuck the boot in the left not the right

    • Mike Murray

      It was the Third Way that gave the Tories the justification for destroying the Welfare State and privatising the NHS.

  • Anonymous
    • Anonymous

      Especially this bit:

      “So, what should Labour MPs do now? Their wisest course is to reject the notion that Miliband is the sole source of their problems – or, in contrast, that he is their sole means of salvation. It’s a judgement call whether any other leader over the past 15 months would have navigated Labour to a larger lead over the Tories. In my view, Miliband is unpopular largely because Labour remains unpopular.”.

      I can’t imagine the other Ed or his wife doing anything to boost their popularity.

      This is the problem with “me, too” politics. Labour have been so keen to appeal to readers of certain newspapers they are too similar to the Coalition. You can’t have three parties all chasing the same narrow audience, because usually they feel the devil they know is better than the devil they don’t

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Mike-Homfray/510980099 Mike Homfray

    Broad principles, but three years before an election, not detailed policies

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