Yes, most of the men who committed abuse in Rotherham were Pakistani. So what’s next? 

3rd September, 2014 8:25 am

A few months ago a friend sent me a private conversation he had, to which I could only respond with: “holy shit!” He had been flirting on Tinder, and after a match a conversation was struck up, she asked where he was from. He flippantly replied that he was Asian, to which her response was something like, “oh right, shouldn’t you be chatting to someone ten years younger than me then? lol.” He couldn’t even muster up the energy to get angry about it, nor explain that he was of Indian origin.


Following the horrific report of sexual abuse in Rotherham for over a decade, I suspect there will be more incidents like this. Plenty of men and women have warned of demonisation and stigmatisation of Asian, or more specifically, Pakistani men over the last week. But I’ll be honest, that’s not my main concern. This may sound flippant but there are bigger issues at stake here than worrying that some of my kind might get spurned by a potential date.

Yes, most of the men who were found to have groomed and raped young girls in Rotherham were Pakistani. The same was the case in Oxford, Rochdale, Oldham and Manchester. There are other such cases and more will likely come to light. Some Labour commentators, such as Kevin Meagher, have gone as far as to say that their background and heritage was “the central issue”. What, even more central than figuring out how to prevent more such cases?

Let’s acknowledge that most of these men were of Pakistani heritage. Ok, done. What next? Should all Pakistani men be banned from approaching white children? Should any Pakistani men in groups be considered a rape gang and placed under police monitoring? Should they be banned from being councillors? Some have declared that this means multiculturalism has been a failure. OK…so should they be deported en masse? This is the bit where people go quiet.

Did these men abuse these girls because they were white? In some cases, like in Rochdale, the men used racially charged language. But this is only part of the story. If the rapists in Rotherham and elsewhere targeted white girls because they were racist, what about the Pakistani girls who were abused? The leader of the Rochdale gang was also found guilty of repeatedly raping an Asian girl. There have been numerous other examples.

The extraordinary bravery of women like Ruzwana Bashir and Shaheen Hashmat in talking about the abuse they faced blows a big hole in this narrative about race. Unsurprisingly, their voices have been glaringly ignored by men who claim to be standing up for victims. Dan Hodges, for example, ignores the mention of Pakistani women in the report entirely.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * *

“I do not care where they come from as long as they are stopped and brought to justice. I told Parliament in 2012 that the ethnicity of the perpetrators was an issue, not the issue. It was not the abusers’ race that defined them, but their attitude to women and girls. They targeted girls because of their vulnerability, and failings by those who should have safeguarded them.”

That was prosecutor Nazir Afzal, writing in the Mail on Sunday, whose diligent work earlier made the Rochdale gang prosecutions possible. Of course he’s going to say that – he’s one of them, you may argue. If that’s the case I have a few questions.

If political correctness was the main reason the police let these abuses carry on, what about the countless other cases where the abuse of girls by white men has gone ignored? In the case of Savile and others this went on for decades.

If the authorities ignored these girls because of racial sensitivity, what about the instances (from the Rotherham report) where its admitted women “were not readily accepted” in the council (13.63), that the council culture was “macho and sexist” (13.64); where a woman was told she “ought to wear shorter skirts to meetings” (13.65)? Is that irrelevant?

If political correctness is to blame for Rotherham, what about the numerous cases listed where the police and children’s social care “were ineffective and seemed to blame the child” (5.24) or said the mother “was not able to accept her growing up” (5.23)

If the police are so good to tackling sexual abuse when racial sensitivity isn’t impeding them, why are their units to tackle rape failing so badly and leaving rapists at large? Last week a student wrote that she was raped at Oxford University, and the police pressured her into dropping the charges.

Let’s talk openly about what happened and by whom. Let’s acknowledge that cultural values played a part. But the cases from Rotherham and other towns, as well as the countless other similar cases, have their root in the same problem: misogyny. Trying to make race the “central issue” is a deflection.

If political correctness and ethnicity was the main issue in Rotherham, it’s remarkable that British authorities have managed to replicate the same problems elsewhere.

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  • Paul

    I’m not clear how the ‘what next?’ bit of the headline is covered in this piece, other than a bland ‘let’s talk about misogyny’.

    This is a partial reading of the problems facing us, and if we really are to move on the what next bit we need to be a bit clearer about the reasons for the rise in CSE, which the Jay report acknowledges has taken place since the 1990s (albeit while pointing out the inadequacies of the data). This rise is related less to poor policing in than to social changes, especially the rise of mobile technologies and the dehumanising effects of readily available internet porn, although there may also be wider issues of male ’emasculation’ (as Phil puts it at A Very Public Sociologist). I hope the enquiry when it comes tackles this stuff, rather than focusing on the easy targets – social workers working in a council with a 43% vacancy rate, and such like.

  • markmyword49

    Part of the problem is that these types of crime are often put in the “too hard” category by the authorities. The crimes are hard to prove to a jury, as a retired judge pointed out to universal condemnation recently. Many victims live lifestyles that juries rarely encounter and don’t understand. Juries are made up of human beings and however hard they try they take their prejudices into the jury room when they deliberate.
    The furore over the ethnicity of the perpetrators of these high profile cases doesn’t alter the fact that most rapes and abuse are carried out within the family or by “friends” not by strangers. Getting not just the victim but their family members to admit that it’s happening is difficult and time and resource consuming. The CPS and those police who truly care have an unenviable job when trying to decide if there is enough evidence that would convince a jury. They are condemned if the go forward and lose and condemned if they drop the case.
    The only losers are the victims.

  • Steve Stubbs

    “have gone as far as to say that their background and heritage was “the central issue”. What, even more central than figuring out how to prevent more such cases?”

    You can’t figure out how to prevent stuff until you know the causes. The main cause (issue) is that which it is essential to identify. Related causes are important, to expand the understanding, but if you can’t even acknowledge the central issue we might as well all go home and forget it. Your article still smacks of trying to defend the indefensible.

    “Let’s acknowledge that most of these men were of Pakistani heritage”.

    No let’s acknowledge that most were from one particular Pakistani heritage, which is where the roots of this lie. The rest of Pakistani men may have their own issues, but this one is tribal.

  • Harry

    I agree with some of what you are saying but I find this bit where you propose an unacceptable alternative to be disingenuous and irritating:

    “Some have declared that this means multiculturalism has been a failure. OK…so should they be deported en masse?”

    Nobody worth listening to is proposing that. There’s a middle ground of discussion between a deeply flawed system of race relations that we have and wholesale deportations of a particular ethnicity or nationality. All statements like the one above do is obfuscate the argument and shut down real debate – as you say ‘people go quiet’.

    • gunnerbear

      Why not deport ’em? They’ve behaved like tribal, savage scum.

      • ColinAdkins

        Where to?

        • gunnerbear

          How about right into the arms of the Islamic scum in Iraq.

          • Harry

            Deporting British citizens (of Pakistani descent but I assume not citizenship) to a terrorist group probably isn’t the best idea, not least because having the Government act as a recruiting sergeant for a bunch of fanatical jihadis probably wouldn’t get positive results. There’s also the wider principle of not deporting citizens to countries of their grandparents’ ethnic/religious upbringing – it’d be like deporting me to New Zealand because my grandparents lived there in the 50s.

            However, I don’t expect to persuade you – from your other comments on this page you appear to conflate these crimes as an excuse for ethnic cleansing, and hence seem to be one of those not worth listening to that I referred to in my original post.

          • gunnerbear

            I’ve never suggested ethnic cleansing – just that with all the fantastic rights of being a British Subject, there are responsibilities too. If they didn’t fancy Iraq, there’s always Saudi, Pakistan and France. Can you imagine the shame and horror of being exiled to France.

          • Harry

            I know, people rarely explicitly call for it – but suggesting that all muslims should be deported is what that amounts to. Agree that there’s a hypocrisy in those who insult the values that protect them, but applying a blanket approach to all muslims in this country is as unhelpful as it is morally unacceptable (to the majority). All it does is provide ammo for the anti-racist shutdown arguments that I took issue with in my original comment.

          • gunnerbear

            Blanket approach to Muslims? Why doesn’t that community point more fingers then at the bad boys and girls?

    • gunnerbear

      Perhaps, a few decades ago, M’Lord Justice would’ve been reaching – rightly – for his black cap.

  • DDpp

    What’s next? Facilities for more victims to come forward. Extension of investigations to other towns.

    Headline like this in the Telegraph may contribute towards the contextualisation of race and religion:

    Daily Telegraph May 16, 2013:

    ‘Imams promote grooming rings’, Muslim leader claims

    The article continues:
    The Oxford grooming ring was promoted by imams who encourage followers to think white women deserve to be “punished”, an Islamic leader has claimed.’

    Dr Taj Hargey, imam of the Oxford Islamic Congregation, said race and religion were inextricably linked to the recent spate of grooming rings in which Muslim men have targeted under-age white girls.

    Earlier this week seven members of a child sex ring from Oxford were found guilty of forcing under age girls to commit acts of “extreme depravity”.

    Their victims, aged between 11 and 15, were groomed and plied with alcohol and drugs before being sexually assaulted and forced into prostitution. They targeted “out of control” teenagers.

    Dr Hargey said that the case brought shame on the city and the community and is a set back for cross community harmony.

    But worse still is the refusal to face up to its realities, he wrote in the Daily Mail.

    ”The activities of the Oxford sex ring are “bound up with religion and race” because all the men – though of different nationalities – were Muslim and they “deliberately targeted vulnerable white girls, whom they appeared to regard as ‘easy meat’, to use one of their revealing, racist phrases”, Dr Hargey said.

    It appears that Dr Hargey believes that there IS a strong connection with religion and race. Why should I believe you after reading his words? He speaks frankly: you gloss over the central issues. Every time you write on these matters your credibility shrinks.

    • gunnerbear

      There is a strong connection between colour & creed. These disgusting inadequate men believe in a religion where women are seen as objects. I’d argue that Muslim men – those who really do believe and shout about the glory of the ‘kiddie f**ker Allah’ – are failures as men and cling to a 14th Cent0ury ideology because they can’t cope with the modern world. And of course in the modern world, in the liberal Western World, these inadequate men can’t deal with women as equals. Islam is a creed that is incompatible with modern, liberal, democratic values.

      • ColinAdkins

        So what creed were Saville, Harris and Smith?

        • gunnerbear

          Same creed – scum. Deport them as well. I’m given to understand Saudi is quite nice at this time of year!

          • PoundInYourPocket

            How can you deport Saville ?

          • Hugh

            Or Smith for that matter. Is their nationality or the fact they’re dead the bigger barrier?

          • gunnerbear

            See response to PIYP.

          • Hugh

            Yes, I see. I remain unconvinced that “deporting” UK nationals is entirely practical, even where they do have a pulse.

          • treborc1

            Of course your right, but if these people are not nationals then why should we not kick them out after the prison term. We do expect people not to rape children, you may treat people like animals in your own country but not here . Then again when you see the protection of people like Saviile and the way the police see no evil, not sure what to think any more.

          • Hugh

            Where people are not UK nationals deportation for serious offences seems reasonable.

          • gunnerbear

            Really? Dig the f***ker up and bin ‘im.

      • PoundInYourPocket

        You’re reading a lot into this. Wasn’t it just a bunch of blokes that wanted sex with teenagers ? Not such a rare emotion I believe. No need to start a new crusade. Or are you also calling for a religious crusade against all the other rapists and child abusers that don’t have pakistani grandparents ? A few Catholics come to mind.

    • PoundInYourPocket

      Three issues:
      1. There’s the propensity of people to commit these acts.
      2. There’s the efficiency of the systems designed to prevent , detect and stop the perpetrators.
      3. There’s the vulnerability and availability of the victims.
      You can work on all three of these, but it’s quicker to focus on 2 and 3 as you might need a thousand years to stop people wanting to commit child abuse, whether it’s dressed up in culture and race or whatever. So as Sunny says it’s rather irrelevant, at least in the short term, why they commit the crime; the main issue must be to improve 1 and 2 above.

  • RWP

    The title of the article implies that there is something to be defensive / embarrassed / ashamed in even acknowledging the racial dimension. Who cares what nationality these abusers are? Why is it a delicate issue, seemingly, that the men in quesiton are Asian/Pakistani? Would this apologetic tone be used if it was white British abusers?

    • gunnerbear

      Of course it would be….it’s because they are non-white and in Labour’s eyes, that means the non-whites can do no wrong, Remember what Macshane has admitted…because he was a “Guardian reading liberal leftie” he “shied away from the issue of the oppression of women in the Muslim community”.

      • ColinAdkins


        • gunnerbear

          Not my words – Macshane’s own. He could have done something but dodged it.

      • PoundInYourPocket

        McShane shied away from everything other than self-promotion. The man is an odious toad with the sole aim of promoting his book. He’ll be on the BBC game-show rota from now on. I would rather rely on the Jay report than anything that seeps out of McShane.

  • Matthew Blott

    A phrase with the words “sand”, “buried” and “head” springs to mind.

  • PoundInYourPocket

    Another good article Sunny. The press and some disreputable politicians are trying to raise the status of political correctness as a cause of inaction here, which is hindering a proper analysis of what ocurred. McShane’s radio 4 interview lasdt week was an appalling example, and ended with him trying again to flog his book.
    Political correctness was not a main cause of inaction and the jay report makes it clear what the main causes actually were: police attitudes, CPS guidelines, lack of resources, bad management and possble illegality & corruption within the council. There is no suggestion that anyone chose to ignore child rape rather than face censure for being politically incorrect. As you say, and it’s a critical point, many victims were asian. The reason most victims were white is simply because that reflects the ethnicity of the local population, and more of those in the vulnerable category (out late / in-care / neglected) are also white. The question does remain – why have the gangs that peretrate this type of crime been mainly young asian ? That is a legitimate question and may simply be that most taxi drivers in those ares are asian, and being a taxi driver gives them easy access to scholl children. Or perhaps there is something in the culture – but it’s a minor and almost irrelevant point compared to the primary need to stop these crimes. Even if there are cultural factors, they’ll take generations to change. So focusing on the assumed PC culture of the Labour Party or the possible mysogeny of young male asians are both distracions from the main challenge of getting the perpetrators behhind bars.

    • David Lewis

      Well you can pretend that it was not a Labour/Pakistani ethnic male coalition, but everyone else knows that in effect it was.

      • PoundInYourPocket

        Did you enjoy reading the Jay report ?

    • gunnerbear

      Honestlu PIYP – defend your Red mob tribe to the hilt – but the fact is that the Rotherham Labour Party worked to cover up the activities of non-whites to protect votes.

      • PoundInYourPocket

        I’m not defending any of the elected scum in Rotherham, I want the truth to get out and arses set on fire. But I don’t like the race card being played on this issue as the Daily Moron love to do. Race and ethnicity isn’t the main point or the main driver. The point is misuse of public office and gross neglect of duty. The reasons are many as I’ve outlined elsewhere. Why try and turn this into a race or ethnic issue ?

        • Steve Stubbs

          Surely the misuse of public office and gross neglect of duty was a race issue? Or at least heavily influenced by race?

          • PoundInYourPocket

            Are you suggesting that the police and/or councillors or council officers/staff did not investigate claims of rape , or kept quiet because they were afraid of being criticised of racial prejudice or racial insensitivity ? If so I think that’s untrue and I don’t see evidence for it in the Jay report. There are reported concerns about the difficulties in raising these issues, but I don’t think that’s what stopped anyone dead in their tracks. My reading of the Jay report and news reports is that they were just scared of the extent of child abuse and looking incompetent rather than afraid that anyone would brand them as racists for raising it. Which sane person prefer the accusation of having ignored child rape to the accusation of being non-PC ?

          • Steve Stubbs

            Then I suggest you re-read the Jay report.

        • Steve Stubbs

          Surely the misuse of public office and gross neglect of duty was a race issue? Or at least heavily influenced by race?

  • Solomon

    Why are my comments not showing up?

  • Evil Racist Bigot

    So upon the revelation that thousands of pubescent white girls have been sexually enslaved in a SINGLE town, by overwhelmingly Pakistani men (who number fewer than 4,000 in Rotherham), the first issue that the author wants to draw attention to is racism against Asians.

    Not the kind of racism where girls are targeted for years of sexual enslavement and sadistic torture because the are worthless infidel whores. No, nothing as trivial as that. Rather, the real issue is people hearing moderately tasteless jokes over social media.

    And the irony is that in the same article where the author’s priorities are so flagrantly distorted by political correctness, he then goes on to deny that political correctness is any part of the problem here.

  • Zafar,

    It’s beyond belief that in 21st century Britain, after everything Britain fought for in 2 World wars, this is the way of thinking of British community.

    I am a British Pakistani and you should know from the surveys that British Pakistanis are more proud to be British than any other community.

    So when our silent majority (like 99%) read about this handful of scum that exist in our community we are enraged, we are more enraged by the British authorities who brush these issues under the carpet, ignorance never resolved anything. The problem should be dealt with head on, this is what all of us want, we want maximum sentences for these perpetrators, yet we are always made the scapegoats. You consistently read of papers like the Daily Mail saying xyz did not mention they were of Pakistani origin enough, that’s just really clever, persecute us all, teach us all a lesson for the doings of a few scum balls, persecute us, but don’t ever mention Churchill again, because clearly you are everything he was not.

    Whilst you’re at it, start thinking about the ethnicities of Jimmy Savile and other famous TV personalities, and of the multitude of priests, more recently DJ Neil Fox, and God knows how many other white people who are peadophiles and ask the question why the media does not refer to them as ‘white middle class men’, whereas it refers to this scum as ‘Pakistani/Asian men’.

    Shame on what the present British society has become, shame on you for being cowards in not being able to protect the innocents of society and making the rest of our majority community the scapegoats of your own failures.

  • Zafar,

    And carry on with this persecution because let me tell you frankly we are sick of this racism anyway, and I assure you it is not the scum people like those groomers or the weirdo jihadis that will be going anywhere soon, it is people like me with MBA’s and PHD’s that are the ones looking to leaving this country for good and heading somewhere that really does uphold the values of Churchill.


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