Why are a public body sending out anti-union political tweets?

22nd December, 2011 2:04 pm

Is TFL being politicised by Boris Johnson…? 

 

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  • It is a pretty outrageous strike though, isn’t it?

    • Anonymous

      Tommy long  who is very short on what he says.

      Well if you do not want them to strike deal with it.

      • GuyM

        So you think triple pay and a day off, simply because you can hold London to ransom is ok?

        I can think of other ways of “dealing with it” myself, driverless trains being the obvious solution.

        • PH

          “Driverless” trains still have to be manned by someone, so the problem won’t go away.

        • Dave Postles

          ‘So you think triple pay and a day off, simply because you can hold London to ransom is ok?’
          Seems to have worked o.k. for the bankers.  I expect ASLEF is just following that lead.  Once one set of greedy mobsters goes down that route, others will follow, sadly.  All those ATMs which have replaced tellers and customer services people are driver-less banks. 

          • Andian59

            Shows the ignorance of some people about train drivers saying  they are skilless and  talentless. Being a driver of any public transport is a high responsibility job with many lives dependant on them to be kept safe. What about those who have lost lives whilst doing their jobs driving the public. Extremely insulting making these degrading remarks about people doing their jobs. I wonder what these people do for work that make these comments. Id like to know what thoroughly usefull existances they have that gives them the right to make such judgements.

          • GuyM

            Because using an ATM 24/7 is so much more hassle than standing in a long queue to see a teller.

            Like the automatic rail ticket machines are a nightmare on a Monday morning compared to the queue out the door and around the block as some old lady decides she wants to explore, in the middle of rush hour, the various options of going to some quaint little location in a months time.

            I have realised you really are a luddite aren’t you? You truly think I want to pay a lot more for services in order to employ people to do things that can be done through automated services?

            ATMs, Ticket Machines, Driveless Trains…. all good by me. You still need customer service reps and tellers during working hours, just much fewer of them.

            But then you do go for non-jobs on the left don’t you. Lots of low skilled jobs to soak up the unemployable rump that is your core vote.

          • Dave Postles

            So much for your concern for people working in financial services and banks, which was the point which I was making.  You want to preserve non-jobs for people who speculate and mess up the country, but you will discard others. 

            Good luck with your ‘Driveless’ (sic) trains.

            As for Luddite, I’d compare my IT skills with your IT skills any day. 

          • Bill Lockhart

            Most lines on the Underground are effectively automatic already. The people in the cabs aren’t even called drivers any longer: they press a button when the passengers are on board an the rest is computerised. £52 K + blackmail strikes for those “skills”- nice work if you can get it.

          • GuyM

            Pedantic as well I see, typos in a blob page don’t interest me in the slightest, but for you they are some sort of badge of honour if you can point them out.

            I am concerned for the Financial Services industry as a whole. That does not mean I am concerned that every job within it is kept as is for ever and ever, irrespective of technology change.

            Loads of tellers now would be provision of non jobs given the rise of internet banking and ATMs. Some are needed but far fewer than 20 years ago. If that means some jobs are lost as new vacancies open up so be it.

            I suspect that my “IT skills” or should we say experience of implementing IT, far far exceeds yours in every way.

          • Dave Postles

            ‘ should we say’
            No, let’s consider IT skills, including implementation, because I have wide experience in that too, as well as programming and CLI. 
            Accuracy is important in all media and writing styles, IMHO, and I’m sure that some others here would agree with that.
            Go back and check ‘concensus’ or the use of the first person personal pronoun, for example, which are others of your mistakes despite the superior education of you and your wife at grammar and private school.
            Now I have to go, but I regard all your obiter dicta here as further examples of your lack of humility.

          • Anonymous

            Actually double time for  Sunday, triple time for a holiday, bank holidays and triple time for Christmas day plus a day in lieu is actually the agreed working of the old British rail, it is also the agreed working agreements of the building and trade Unions, going way back to the 1960 agreed with the then Conservative  government

          • GuyM

            And fortunately we dont live in a union dominated 1960s or 1970s, despite what the brothers would like and some parts of Labour think would be best.

            Best solution entails hopefully, ASLEF strike, TFL lay on more buses and keep most tubes running and the public see what a spiteful lot the tube unions are once more.

            Bang goes another chunk of public support.

          • Anonymous

            Yawn

          • GuyM

            And I’ll say again I don’t check a single thing as I type, this isn’t a business document and I don’t care.

            However, I come across your kind before many times on the web, you use the odd error in spellnig or grammar as an additional attack point or some attempt to appear superior without actually being superior. My guess is you take ages re-reading and checking a post, whereas I have better things to do in life. So you feel free to point out any error in my writing and I’ll just keep to the single word retort – pedantic – from now on.

            So as to IT skills, that’s the entire BI/Analytics market, CRM, SFA, Customer Services software and just about every aspect of the data/information/intelligence stream you care to mention.

            Throw in multi channel integration, multinational programme implementation and not having had a single project overrun in time, budget or fail to deliver acceptance criteria in nearly 7 years.

            Some things I don’t have any interest in doing, coding, infrastructure or getting into inane conversations about the detail of OS, DB or similar. I’ll leave that to the functionaries in IT departments.

            I’m solely interested in the correct macro decisions and ensuring global implementations of software deliver the benefits, ROI and strategu goals they are intended to.

            My experience of “programmers” or code monkeys is that only around 10% or so are up to being put in front of internal or external clients, they are much like the hilarious characters out of The IT Crowd.

            So you go ahead and spout on about programming, I gave it up with visual basic and C+ many many moons ago.

            Oh and that point about accuracy… it is only useful where accuracy is an important part of a wider construct… news for you Dave.. a LL blog isn’t that important, but you troll on being pedantic.

            And I say “troll” because looking through your posts over numerous threads I see a marked absence of the grammar police (and in particular you) picking up on errors on LL. You use it as a means of attack, which makes you a very sad little man and pedantic with it.

            But anyway, the main point Mr Postles is that I’d take the entire bloody Financial Services industry and every banker, no matter how venal, over the whining whinging moaning mass of northern lefties like you.

            As I’ve said we aren’t “in it alltogether” and I’m happy to sacrifice your like by the wayside for the best interests of London and the SE.

          • Dave Postles

            Dr Postles, to you.  All of your above comments are wild of the mark.  Fine, I’m not bothered.  No, I don’t spend time checking my posts, although I notice stuff retrospectively.  Actually, I have several big research projects involving large datasets for which I have to do my own data inputting (being retired) and analysis, so I could counter all your stuff, but I’ll spare LL and use my own time more productively. 

          • Dave Postles

            Oh, and unlike some business stats people, I know the difference between parametric and non-parametric stats and use them appropriately.

          • GuyM

            Tediously boring as always.

            You are not likely to have much of a commercial background. Therefore your input on “commercial” areas simply isn’t needed or valuable.

            Have a nice Christmas in your retirement.

          • GuyM

            Good, run along then and go bother some other people with your holier than thou attitude.

            And I regard “Dr” as a mark of respect, so you’re Mr Postles to me, or even just Postles.

            I guessed you were retired, it comes through heavily in your opinions and comments.

  • GuyM

    Because the strike is totally outrageous.

    Damaging the retail sector of London, holding hundreds of thousands of people to ransom again.

    And what are they after?

    THREE days pay and a day off in lieu for working one day. Double pay is standard and fair, but oh no the train drivers, already hitting £52,000 pa for little in the way of intelligence of high skilled jobs, because they can hold the public to ransom want even more.

    In addition they are all getting a special £1,300 payment each for promising not to strike during the Olympics.

    The plan I believe eventually is for driverless trains on London Underground and the sooner we get that the better.

    • rbolt

      “the train drivers, already hitting £52,000 pa for little in the way of intelligence of high skilled jobs”

      In other words, less educated people don’t deserve to be paid a lot of money.  To follow this logic, you would also have to apply the same reasoning to people working in financial services earning twice as much at least.  Moving lots of money around does not require very much in the way of intelligence beyond being able to speculate.  I don’t hear many right-wingers calling for bankers and bosses to be paid a bit less, though.   

      “The plan I believe eventually is for driverless trains on London Underground and the sooner we get that the better.”

      In other words, phase out all the jobs where union membership is currently strong, and move people into industries where it is weak.  Combined with an increasingly stupifying and pacifying education system we’ll soon have the workforce every capitalist craves for: lots of zombies walking around chanting “I must work harder for less”. 

  • Anonymous

    Because the Union is a political body using its power to gouge money and concessions from the taxpayer once again?

    Because most Londoners seem to HATE the Unions and the disruption they cause at what seems like the drop of a hat?

    • Dave Postles

      Obviously the greed down there is contagious.

      • GuyM

        As per my comments on another thread… here we go with the anti south and London stuff once more.

        It’s ok with me though, so long as you accept no sympathy for anywhere in north or any “community” there suffering from cuts.

        If it were possible I really do think “independence” for both areas of the UK would be in order. I’d be more than happy to wave goodbye to everything north of Birmingham.

        • Stuart

          Be interesting to see which way the West Midlands would go, in the event that a referendum was held whether to join South England or North England. Being from round those parts I think we’d vote to go with the North, if only because of the (perhaps a bit over-the-top) hatred in which London is held. Be ashame to lose Devon and Cornwall, though…

          • Trust me, theres no love lost for London in Devon & Cornwall. Rest of the south west might be a different issue…

          • Got me thinking about the lack of love between Devon and Cornwall.

            I notice that Devon has now countenanced Cornwall with a flag of their own. And from sentiments common in Cornwall re the rest of England I wouldn’t be surprised if Cornwall upped-anchor and repositioned itself half-a-mile westwards.

            And they’d probably get a helpful push-off from Devon just to indicate the extent of the accord.

          • Anonymous

            Which bit of the West Midlands FFS!

            The Range Rover , Aston Martin, Jaguar, BMW workforces?

            The NEC?

            Hatred of London is in your mind, not on the balance sheets.

          • Dave Postles

            What’s that all about then?

          • Redshift

            West Midlands manufacturing would be better off with an economic policy that would suit the north than the south…

        • Dave Postles

          Nothing wrong with the south.  I enjoy my holidays at the Sherborne Hotel (Martyn’s Hotels – £99 for 3/4 nights half-board) and the visits to the interesting Sherborne and the Dorset coast.  They are kindly people at the hotel and in Dorset.  Then, of course, we had the brave-hearted Kentish coalminers – not all in the North, you know. 
          Nah, it’s the greed that permeates London.
          BTW, I expect that you have finally caught up with the trading bloc, Mercosur, as if there were no other trading blocs in the world!

          • GuyM

            Then let London and the SE go it alone, although my experience of Sussex, Hants, Dorset and Herts etc. is that they’d sign up in a flash to staying with London.

            We work hard in London and expect to get paid for it. What we don’t expect is to work to have our wealth redistributed to increase northern incomes.

            I really have nothing positive to say about the attitudes of areas north of Herts and Bucks etc. Just a big chip on the shoulder.

            London is the UKs only global city. Frankly if you don’t like the fact it is more vibrant, financially succesful and pays better then tough. I see no reason why it will be changing any time soon.

            You may not like Londoners attitudes, but I can assure you we don’t give a…..

          • “I really have nothing positive to say about the attitudes of areas north of Herts and Bucks etc. Just a big chip on the shoulder.”

            Following yesterday’s outburst where you fumed, “More than happy to fight a class war any time you like… “,  I suppose the above should not be in least surprising. But it is.

            And also very disappointing. You are becoming an embarrassment on this blog, to others and, more importantly, to yourself. You bring your own arguments, such as they are, into disrepute.

            You seem to be sustained by a bottomless well of bitterness. A coherent and convincing political position will never be drawn from such a sour source.

          • GuyM

            Spend a few months engaging with people on LL and you will find endless insults, snide jokes and calls to do somerthing about the “south and London”.

            On another thread a regular poster claims people in London are all greedy.

            If you don’t like the reciprocal views then tough. Just about all of my friends in London are of the same view, sick to death with northerners moaning about London and sick to death with public sector unions.

            As you said yourself, you’d like us to “share”, what is that exactly? The cost of the NHS, education and the like? fine, just do try and pay a little more up north sometime.

            But “share” in terms of redistributing income? No thanks, we don’t owe you a thing thanks.

            So I’m happy to be a southerner and a Londoner by birth. I’m happy with the banks, happy with the City, happy with Financial Services, happy with our employment rates and house prices, happy with our wealth and don’t want to give you a penny of it thanks very much.

            My “convincing and coherant” political position is I don’t support redistribution to cover the north’s failings (other than for standard national services). So I often vote Tory, often for no other reason than they unlike Labour won’t seek to fleece me due to wanting to bribe their electorate in the north with my redistributed earnings.

            I don’t like the north, don’t like its politics or attitudes. I am very happy for you all to stay up there and do very well, so long as you do it off your own backs and not London and the South’s.

          • Dave Postles

            ‘On another thread a regular poster claims people in London are all greedy.’
            No, he said that greed permeates London.  There is a difference.  You are an exemplar. 

          • GuyM

            Really? Because I earn my market rate, pay my taxes and look after my family?

            Because I believe in taxation to pay for things like the NHS and education system across the whole of the UK but I don’t believe in redistribution to increase low northern wages at the cost of my income?

            So what your basically saying is unless I agree to let you take whatever you think you should from my worked for income then I’m “greedy”?

            Perfect example of the “perceptions” we southerners have of you pontificating holier than thou northern critics.

          • Dave Postles

            East-Midland leftie critic, please.

          • GuyM

            That’s northern as far as I’m concerned.

          • Dave Postles

            Picking up the tab for London.

            Dear Dave,
            Click here to see our Christmas message

            I’ve
            been told by Centrepoint that you recently sent a gift to help out
            homeless young people over Christmas and I wanted to write and say thank
            you.

            You
            may remember my story from the Christmas appeal. I’m one of the lucky
            ones who have been helped by Centrepoint. I’m studying at University now
            and looking forward to the New Year but if it wasn’t for people like
            you, I might still be homeless.

            I
            want you to know that your gift could do amazing things. Even if a
            homeless young person only gets just one night in a hostel over
            Christmas, it can make a huge difference to them.

            Being
            around positive people and others who are in the same position as you
            can help you to realise that you have options. You’ve made that possible
            for a young person and they might go on to study at uni too, or get a
            job and be able to have a happy life like mine, regardless of what’s
            happened to them in the past.

            That’s an amazing Christmas present to give anyone, so I hope you feel really proud of what you’ve done. I know I would.

            Have
            a wonderful New Year and keep up the good work! And please always
            remember there are loads of young people just like me who are so
            grateful for your generosity.

            Yours sincerely,

            Zoe Davies

          • Dave Postles

            BTW, that’s in addition to 24 pounds per month and regular one-off donations (about 500 pounds this year in one-off gifts).  If you can’t look after your own, someone else has to pick up the tab out of compassion – even from the East Midlands. 

          • GuyM

            Good for you, I don’t tend to publicise my charitable donations however.

            “Pontificating holier than thou” was the phrase wasn’t it?

          • Well yes, you have to make charitable donations AT ALL for that.

          • You don’t have to be northern to think London is rotten.

          • Bill Lockhart

            permeate- “spread throughout”. If greed permeates London without all Londoners being greedy then equally, whining false entitlement and criminality “permeates” Merseyside without all Scousers being criminals or scroungers. Is that OK to say?
            Lazy judgemental generalisations are either acceptable or they aren’t.

          • You take insults about you as aimed at anything but you. you mean. No, it’s you.

            You vote Tory because you’re you’re a core Tory supporter. You dislike the poor, you’re xenophobic enough to dislike even many other English people…

          • Anonymous

            Hi Roderic, I grew up in Essex, but also lived for a time in Wiltshire, and later Australia for about 3 years. As a young adult I spent about 10 years living in London; then my partner was relocated to the Midlands, and we’ve been here about 18 years.

            I enjoyed all; but I’d say people are particularly open and friendly more so here, and more of a community feel.It’s a wonderful place to live- surrounded by green spaces, but easily accessible to all parts of the country.

            I’ve never heard anything so strange as suggesting areas of the country should be cordoned off; it seems to be more a figment of imagination than reality.

            I don’t think it’s possible to generalize about any area or people living there; there are extremes of wealth and poverty anywhere. OK, probably a greater concentration of wealth in the SE; but also house prices exhorbitant and well out of reach for most young people and first time buyers- which needs addressing pronto.
            And yet, probably more choice of employment in London- it’s ironic.

            Certainly a whole mix of factors; but I’m utterly against any kind of stereotyping.

            May I ask where is your neck of the woods?

            Good to see you as a newcomer on LL Roderic-
            hope you plan to stick around.

            Jo

          • jaime taurosangastre candelas

            I believe in the United Kingdom as a nation, and strongly support what our G7 status can do in things like international development, so I’m not with you on this balkanisation of the UK.  However, several small but rich nations like Luxembourg indicate that for some parts of the UK (e.g. London + SE) life as a small nation running a service-based economy could be good.

            Perhaps of interest, I read a study in the Economist a while back that states that if the UK were divided into two, the most obvious place to do it would be on a line from the Wash to Bristol (it did not discuss devolution or independence of Scotland and Wales).  Half the population is south and east of that line, half above.  The southern region is mostly based on services, the northern region much more balanced with manufacturing as well.  The southern region is currently 62% of GDP, but as it is services based that is more volatile.  The article did not talk about politics, but it occurs to me that the northern region would tend to routinely return a Labour majority, and the southern region routinely a tory majority.  Perhaps it could be a happy divorce?

          • GuyM

            Exactly on the happy divorce, but I’d split 50% 50% based upon land size, not population. The northerners love their empty spaces? they dont need the population then.

          • Redshift

            Lol, here we get all the caveats…

          • GuyM

            No caveats, 50:50 split land wise. Happy with all other criteria then.

            I’ve yet to see any countries split on population rather than territory, so go for a 50:50 split and lets see how you get on.

          • GuyM

            Afterall if it’s so damn good up north everyone will be moving up there to your land of socialism wont they?

          • derek

            Well, we’ll park the four nuclear subs in Surry, right outside your front door.

          • GuyM

            More than happy with that. I like the nuclear deterrant thanks

          • derek

            LoL! I think your like the detergent more?

          • jaime taurosangastre candelas

            @ GuyM,

            the maths is not going to work out for you on a 50:50 land split.  Looking at Wikipedia and figures for regional land and regional population (e.g. East of England, SW England as government regions), you are going to have a difficult (for you) choice:

            50:50 land split between all regions of the UK is every part of England less NE England, against Wales, Scotland, NI and NE England.  That is 76.75% of the total UK population.  There’s probably too many Labour voters in your 50:50 land split for you to be comfortable.

            If you do want to go on a 50:50 population split, you are getting SW England, SE England, London, the East of England; plus Warwickshire as part of the W Midlands, or Lincolnshire as part of the East Midlands, or Peterborough and Rutland (one of the 3, not all 3).

            I don’t personally want any of this to happen, but that is my view.

          • GuyM

            A 50% split on land, or near enough.

            Then you can have the socialist republic in hte north and a likely Tory majority in the south.

            If people in the south want a socialist wonderland they can move and vice versa.

            The population figures would be irrelevant as a free choice should be open to everyone as to where they wanted to be.

            Seems like an India/Pakistan partition solution, but I’d consider it as I’m sick to death of the Scots and Northerners whining about the South and London.

          • jaime taurosangastre candelas

            Unless you slice up the country a different way, you’ve got to go as far north as Durham before you leave “the southern 50%”.  I think there’s quite a few people who live further south than Durham who would consider themselves as northerners….

          • “However”

            Right, so you’re for breaking up the country. What a surprise.

            No – Let’s have several regions within England with their own local governments, and a Federal government in Westminster.

            But no, you can’t have that. You require only the rich parts of the country in your utopia, the poor can go die.

  • Anonymous

    Guy, I can’t understand why you would want to provoke an argument with such a polite, moderate and reasonable poster, who is also new to LL and should be welcomed.
    Why do you keep throwing in all this stuff
    about “northerners” etc- do you have any experience of living further north of London; do you know anyone who comes from other parts of England? 

    I have no prejudice about anyone’s particular region of the UK; it would be ridiculous and quite offensive to assume negative connotations.

    • GuyM

      I suggest you take a long hard look at the many anti London and Southern comments that are frequently thrown about LL Jo.
       
      To start you off take a look only 2 posts below – “obviously the greed down there is contagious”.
       
      It is always simmering below the surface with a number of posters on LL. The anti south, anti London, anti middle class, anti mangerial feelings. I’ve always thought that the best way to show anyone naive about politics just how venal and unpleasant a lot of people in politics can be is to show the LL  and Conservative Home.
       
      So no I’m very happy down here and wouldn’t go and live north of London for anyway money. In fact Jo I turned down two £600 per day posts in Leeds and Newcastle a few years back, instead leaving the jobs and looking for new employers.
       
      I’m well aware a number of posters don’t like what London and the SE represents politically and economically and I’m happy to throw it right back at them. Any time they want to do without London’s tax revenue they can just say so and go be self sufficient in their areas, they won’t be missed by Londoners.

      • Redshift

        lol. Guy, you are a stereotype! You are doing more to reinforce it, that any single person I’ve spoken to in my life. 

        I lived and worked down south for several years. There are cultural differences, economic differences and political differences but they are over-exaggerated. 

        What makes me laugh is that very small jokes or comments actually framed in a fairly careful way (e.g. above it is said greed permeates London but you took it as a personal attack on all Londoners), you launch into a rant that reinforces all of the things that northerners (and many others) dislike about some of the perceptions that are held down south (or London). 

        You have such a massive superiority complex it is unreal. 
        I think you’d explode if you were challenged to tell a self-deprecating joke. It is really quite pathetic.

        • GuyM

          “small jokes” ahh I see, saying “greed permeates London” is a small joke.

          I think most Londoners I know would treat that as the usual sort of leftwing attack on an area of the country they see as out of touch with their “values”.

          I don’t like northern values Redshift, is that a “very small joke”? The fact the area seems up itself and believes it deserves mass funding and special treatment?

          You say “very small jokes” then state I “reinforce all the things that northerners dislike about perceptions held down south”.

          You can’t have it both ways, you either agree northerners dont like southern “perceptions” or not. If you do believe it then it reinforces my view that the north just have one big chip on the shoulder.

          I really do not see any reason to continue bailing out the north with southern taxpayers money and listening to the bullshit repeatedly about how we don’t fit in with you warm cuddly notions of “community” etc.

          There is a simple solution, you let us keep our tax take ourselves, you don’t come and work down in the south anymore if things are so damn better lifestyle and values wise up there and you pay your own way as a region.

          Because at the moment all it seems like is endless lefties want to bitch about the south, about its voting habits, its values, its preoccuptation with “getting on” and yet still want the tax revenues to fund your social services and the jobs market for lots of northern graduates to move into.

          Simpoly put you read London comment online and see it in person and there are a lot of us sick to effing death about the whines, moans and holier than thou crap about “bankers”, “greed” and “values” the north of the country push at the UKs one global city.

          • Redshift

            I’m saying that you are reinforcing a very negative stereotype of Southerners as stuck up and ignorant – an ignorance that leads to a belief that all the problems up north are simply caused by northerners being lazy or backwards.  

            That doesn’t mean for a moment that northerners genuinely believe that the stereotype is a good representation of what southerners are like, I am saying that this is an obviously existing stereotype.What I am saying is that YOU happen to be that negative stereotype. You know fuck all about the north and the less you comment about it, the less of a cretin you will look. 

      • No, the hatred is of YOU, 1%er. And your kind.

  • guido.fawkes

    Because it is in the public interest rather than the vested interests.

    • The public are all of us.

      Including workers in unions.

      • Billsilver

        More ‘us’ than workers in unions

  • Redshift

    TFL handled this appallingly. 

    Why couldn’t they ask for volunteers to work rather than insisting on certain people working? They haven’t even tried.

    The union want triple time for those that work. In many ways that’s a nice incentive to work on a day that a lot of people will have family commitments, etc on. It is only one day and it is a vital service. More importantly they haven’t for example offered double time, which is a norm for holidays even in low wage jobs. They haven’t tried. 

    It is terrible industrial relations.

    • GuyM

      As I understand it double time is standard for bank holidays for tube drivers and is part of a previous agreement.

      In this case the Union wants triple time and a day off in lieu, so in effect quadruple time. This despite arranging a deal where drivers (who ar enot the best skilled or educated inthe world) get £52,00 pa basic plus £1,300 payments each for promising not to strike during the Olympics.

      The sooner the tube goes to driverless trains the better for everyone other than the driver themselves. They are making a good case to get rid of their jobs on their won with little help from anyone else.

      I can assure you what Londoners think about this, check hte local web pages or comments in the Standard.

      • Of course, gotta have accidents killing thousands. They’re only poor, after all.

        I won’t get on a driver-less accident waiting to happen. The system they’re trialling has been rejected elsewhere for good reason. But hey, it’s cheap.

        • Bill Lockhart

          Better avoid the Docklands Light railway or any airport shuttle then.
          And most Tube trains are automatic already. The system you so fear is already operational. The “drivers” just open and close the doors for their £52k basic. Try to keep up.

    • Bill Lockhart

      They don’t have to ask for volunteers because working on Bank Holidays is already bought out in their agreement- around £1500 a year plus still longer holidays. The ASLEF train operators (not drivers- most deep lines are automatic now)  want to simply renege on their freely-entered-into contract because they want more money for themselves. Not even bankers get away with doing that.

  • Anonymous

    It is absolutely hilarious the way northeners are constantly slagging off London and the south and wishing for their undoing (one person on this blog stating that the sooner london crumbles the better!). They seem to forget who is picking up the bill for their public services. They are a bit like a parasite that actively seeks to kill its host. Talk about cutting off their nose to spite their face.

    • GuyM

      My point exactly, you get the true opinion of a lot of Labour supporters from the north of the country coming out in these sorts of discussions.

      When you give them the same thing back then they really don’t like it one little bit

    • Anonymous


      They are a bit like a parasite that actively seeks to kill its host. Talk about cutting off their nose to spite their face.”

      They don’t have the intelligence to see that – without London and its tax revenues- they’d all be working at £3 per hour.Mind you, it would be a good thing if some of the Northern areas actually worked..

      • Dave Postles

        The City: an alternative perception:
        ‘The Financial services sector contributed £53.4bn in the last tax year
        and accounts for 2.4% of national income. However, this tax contribution
        is eclipsed by the £850billion outlay that UK tax payers have had to
        pay in order to bail out the banks and the billions we are paying to the
        IMF in order to stabilize economies such as Greece; victims of the
        unfettered capitalism practised in the City of London. Furthermore, it
        is estimated that the total damage to the economy from the banking
        crisis and its resultant repercussions has been between 11 and 13% of
        GDP; so overall, we are experiencing a net loss from the City of London.
        Aside from economics, the actual social value of the City of London is
        not reflected in its financial contribution; “On best estimates it
        contributes 3 per cent a year in value added compared to 12.5 per cent
        value added contributed from manufacturing.’
        To that can be added the cost of the civil service in London.  Here’s a question: what number of redundancies has occurred in the London-based civil service so far by comparison with local government?
        BTW, madasafish, their definition of the North includes the E. Midlands, where, I presume, you are located. 

        • GuyM

          London is the capital, centre of the country politically and governmental wise.

          With regard financial services, a false bit of analysis there Postles, as the UK government retains part ownership of the banks which will at least in part offset any investment level.

          But anyway, as I said before, better to support the FS industry (and ni turn London) than throw away billions more on useless public sector non jobs in the north. How can you justify 70% plus of a workforce in some places being in public sector positions?

  • jaime taurosangastre candelas

    A very happy Christmas to all of you, and notwithstanding anyone’s views on the original cause of this annual celebration, whether Christian, pagan, or agnostic of anything, I wish you all every happiness and success in this new year coming.  If it is permitted, I wish our country every good fortune as well, and a more settled and collegiate place among nations. If it is not asking too much, I would like to hope that we all as individuals and as nations recognise and take into our hearts those who are not as fortunate as ourselves.

    • This isn’t happy, it’s a miserable cold holiday for the people you hate. Lying is a sin.

  • Anonymous

    I wonder myself what the management holiday pay is, what the pensions are and what the perks will be for coming in on a holiday. Perhaps the workers have  found out.

    • Dave Postles

      Good stuff, treborc.

  • Anonymous

    No different to the hugely publicly funded Unions taking action to inconvenience those who fund them. 

    Is there? Cake and eat it, eh?

    • What “public funding”?

      No, you’re simply lying again to justify the abuse of funding, because it’s acceptable to you. Gotta hurt the poor more.

      • Bill Lockhart

        Tube drivers “poor”?
        Rolling On The Floor Laughing My Arse Off

  • Really? So the government promised in advance to bail the banks out?

    *checks*

    Nope!

  • Guy Lambert

    I haven’t closely followed the Tube Boxing Day strike, but I must say it has not helped those of us who support TUs.
    If it’s true that tube drivers (or whatever pedants want to call them) earn £52K, and that there was a prior negotiated agreement on this, then I have to side with the antis.
    Treborc’s post about high-paid TfL people is very interesting (or astonishing, or scandalous) and helps give some balance, but I was always taught two wrongs don’t make a right.
    Oh, and TfL should not post such tendentious tweets (?)

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