Labour-backed strikes? Not in my name

November 27, 2011 8:16 pm

Its almost as if some amongst our ranks want to send our credibility into the air with their placards. Much fanfare was made by some Labour members last week when Unite, one of the largest unions, voted to back the November 30th public sector strikes over pensions. Much fanfare, much noise from the noisy left – but no common sense.

Dave Prentis, leader of Unison, said back in September that many of their members would ‘never forgive’ the party unless it backed strike action. Dave, I am positively quaking in my boots. The trade unions need Labour more than Labour needs the trade unions, and they are desperate to turn around their waning influence. I for one – a member of a democratic socialist party – will not be held to ransom by a man who claims to stand for the workers, but still takes home a salary most would kill for.

And remember that turnout – no more than 30% bothered to vote for the Unite vote; which gives those on the picket line about as much of a mandate for their action as the Tories have for their cuts.

As for those Labour members who believe Ed should back the November 30th strikes, and the (as ever) socialist-extremist Owen Jones, a simple thought should pass your mind. Whose side are the voters on?

Whilst public opinion has shifted from that working class core so many still crave to appeal to (it no longer exists), trade unions have stubbornly refused to modernise in the way the party has. We made moves as a party in the 1990s to appeal to a broad coalition of voters; the unions still call for the workers to rise up. We won 3 elections; their support is disappearing.

That is why they desperately cling to us. Their influence over the Labour leadership contest system is utterly archaic when clearly union members don’t speak for the public. At a time where left-wing parties are showing tremendous modernisation across the globe -such as the primaries in France – the Labour Party here is still dictated by outdated unions.

And before the charge of not knowing our history is laid at my door; yes, we were born out of the labour movement, with trade unions by our side. But that requires an equal relationship, and it is one to which they have not adhered to. Where is the modernisation? The balance of power? When they call strikes, it is not in my name.

My Labour Party membership card claims that power must be in the hands of the many, not the few. I trust the British voters; it is to them, and not trade unions, we must speak to. The power of the many must mean power for the people – not those affiliated to a union. Like it or not, this coalition was voted in. They have a mandate. Do the unions speak for the electorate? Of course not. When they do, will the last person to leave Britain please turn out the lights?

  • http://twitter.com/CJWallace91 Chris Wallace

    When you described Owen Jones as ‘socialist-extremist’  I knew that the rest of the article was likely equally as poorly informed. 

    We should indeed talk to the electorate, but the unions remain the most powerful voice working people can use to express their views. Their power is in their organisation, and repeating Tory falsehoods about union barons who take home extortionate pay is deeply unhelpful.

    Instead of insulting the unions who so help our party, we should be helping them to improve their image, and reach out to a greater number of working people. Whether you like it or not, Labour and the unions fate are bound together, leaving them out to rot will only hurt us. 

    I for one am proud that we’re backed by democratic organisations of working people, rather than the powerful rich individuals who bankroll the Conservatives.

    • Anonymous

      Well said Chris.

      Jo

    • http://twitter.com/kulgancrydee Kulgan of Crydee

      Powerful rich individuals… hhhmmm, Ed M, Chukka (family home bought by company in tax haven – Tax AVOIDANCE) … Lord Paul etc etc.  Champagne Socialism is alive and well in the party it seems.

      • http://twitter.com/CJWallace91 Chris Wallace

        Would you like me to go through an exercise comparing and contrasting the various supporters and donations made to the political parties, because I think if I do you’ll find Conservatives come out of it rather badly indeed.

        And I also find your assertion that anyone with wealth should henceforth be banned from the Labour Party very odd indeed. Surely the fact they have come from wealth and still choose to support a party which unashamadely looks out for those who are most in need speaks to their credit?

        I’d certainly rather have someone like Ed Miliband, who came from relatively comfortable backgrounds to lead a party looking to improve the lives of many who struggle to get by, than someone like Cameron or Osborne who were born into wealth and continue to look out for their own.

        You can’t help whether you were born into money any more than you can help whether you were born into poverty, it’s your choices in life that make the difference, and I’d take Ed and Chuka over any Tory every day of the week.

  • gary

    Never mind the turnout,the unions have followed the Thatcher imposed,and the labour maintained secret ballot,for strike action.

  • http://twitter.com/MWheeler25 Michael Wheeler

    Usually LabourList articles are thought-provoking, interesting and at least contain a grain of insight that is worth at least considering, if not adopting as part of one’s political outlook.

    This piece is none of that. Misguided and completely misunderstanding modern trade unionism and, amazingly, the current political situation in this country.

    Am I alone in thinking that the ideas and opinions expressed in this piece would not be out of place in a Tory blog?

    I am tempted to go through it line by line with a counterpoint for each, but no-one has the time to read that and the more I dwell on it, the more this article disappoints me.

  • Heather, Leeds

    The labour party doesn’t need the unions eh?  As I see it, the Labour Party would be bankrupt  without the Unions and without all the work Union activists put in around election time in many towns and cities, the party would not be in power anywhere!

  • Guest

    1. The mandate for strike action – irrespective of turnout – is what our representative democracy requires. There are many local councillors who don’t secure a majority of the electorate in their wards. Do you moan then?

    2. Union members *are* the public.

    3. ‘The power of the many must mean power for the people – not those affiliated to a union’. Do you mean this – or have you missed a word out of the sentence? People in unions *are* people.

    4. ‘Like it or not, this coalition was voted in.’ – actually they were NOT voted in – as a coalition.

    5. ‘They have a mandate’. Now you are just being silly…

    Frankly it is people like you who make me want to tear up my membership.

  • Labour Teacher

    A disappointing contribution to Labour List by Alex White. I am a centrist party member and I am active in the NUT. I fully support strike action and appreciate party colleagues supporting it too – the pension proposals are nothing more than theft by government.

     I am set to lose around £215,000 in further contributions to my pension and a decreased payment, if I live for 25 years after the age of 68.I am 25 years old, four years into my teaching career. I honestly think that if I am still teaching by 30 years old it will be a miracle as it is so tiring and time consuming. Never mind reaching 68!Its a shame that you are unable to see the damage being done by the tories to the dignity of working people and pensioners. Trade unions are made up of ordinary folk who want decent treatment.

    • Dave Postles

      @ Labour Teacher.

      Good luck with your career and thanks for pursuing it.  You can make that difference to a young person’s life.  My own life was rescued by a handful of teachers and I am forever grateful.  I’m sure that you will receive the same gratitude. 

      • Anonymous

        Hear hear Dave, I’d like to second that.

        We all have memories of teachers that inspired great things
        and in some cases changed lives.

        All deserve support and respect.

        Jo

  • Jeremy Corbyn MP

    Oh dear; strange reading of history here. Unions are a democratic representation of workers interests and tehy founded the Labour Party to enhance democracy.
    Now the public sector pension is under threat, and if the ConDem Government has its way it will be open season on private sector schemes even more than is currently the case.
    Maybe 2 million will be on strike on Wednesday; with many more supporting them as they see this as a fight back against austerity, cuts and greater wealth divisions in this country.
    I will be on the picket lines to support those who do a good job, and have supported social advances for decades, and ask for our support now.

    • Anonymous

      Yes and I will be at my local  school picket line….and then down to the hospital and job centre.   I suspect Mr White will be crying into a picture of his beloved Blair

    • http://twitter.com/DelroyBooth Delroy Booth

      Whilst you may be absolutely right Jeremy, doesn’t the appearance of this article on Labourlist discourage you as to the future of the left in the Labour party? This isn’t a one-off crank venting his anger, it’s the dominant tendency within the party you are a member of!

      And as for the article itself, I think people on the right of Labour need to realize it’s not 1983 anymore, and that public attitudes have shifted massively over the last few decades. What was once denounced as “unelectable” and “extremist” within Labour is actually closer to the mood of public opinion than Blairism. People are more combative now than they were then, plus now we happen to be living through the collapse of the Thatcherite/Neo-liberal consensus, so Labour ceding ground to the right at a time like this is madness. Blairism isn’t even electorally viable anymore! They lost millions of votes between the end of the 90′s and the 2010 election, and at the end couldn’t even win the Labour party leadership election. Blair’s saving grace was that he could win elections, but now that is no longer the case why do those on the Labour party right still persist in pushing flogging the dead horse that is New Labour?

      And if the unions left the labour party and funded a proper democratic socialist, one that defended the interests of working people in a crucial period, it would destroy the labour party, just how the SDP ruined Labour election chances for a whole generation when they split. Infact, it would be even worse.

      • Anonymous

        Winning elections – even losing them less badly than the others – is not the key to good performance in government as the current gonzos are showing.

        Labour needs to be assured that we are heading in a sustainable and productive direction, then the public will believe we offer their best shot at a decent future, even if they do hankering after all sorts of trotskist ideas after they’ve been to McDonalds …

    • Anonymous

      May I just say thanks so much for your support Jeremy.

      It’s great to read your comments here.

      Good to know some real Labourites still in the party!!

      Jo

    • Anonymous

      You obviously forgot that Gordon Brown did in private sector pensions years ago!!!

      In the private sector to get a pension with the same annual value as a public sector pension ( with increased contributions) would require paying £600 pm from age 23-65 and even then you would need a very favourable annuity rate.

      Having said that the tories are barking mad on this issue. By their own figures this will produce a saving of only £2.4 billion at a time when they are already paying out around £12 billion in overseas aid, in some instance to countries in a better position than us ( ie India )

      On the whole Alex is right, the public at large are not on the side of the unions in this case.

      • JohnG

        A BBC poll showed 61% in favour of the strikes so that’s the no public support argument shot dead!

        Are you really saying that because private pension provision is so poor that the public sector should stop complaining? The “race to the bottom” is not an argument.

  • http://twitter.com/noirfilmnoir Ian Fellows

    I bailed out about halfway through, did it get any better than “I won’t back the strike because of Dave Prentis’s salary”?

    • http://twitter.com/MWheeler25 Michael Wheeler

      No, it just got worse.

      • http://twitter.com/reddeviljp jaydeepee

        It got a lot worse. I’m afraid this retarded simpleton should not be allowed near a keyboard in future. He needs an education.

        • Anonymous

          Retarded simpleton, so if you have a learning disability you would call the disabled retarded simpletons, well done.

  • Richard Johnson

    This article – MEGAFAIL.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100001102865655 John Ruddy

    How do you explain the fact that ALL the leadership contenders for the post in Scotland – including Tom Harris, who would not object to being called to being on the right of the party – have backed the strikes. Without hesitation. 

    If the cause is just and honourable…..

  • @chrisf91

    There are many aspects of this post that I take issue with.
    But I will only mention the aspect that is fundamentally wrong.
    “Whilst public opinion has shifted from that working class core so many still crave to appeal to (it no longer exists)”
    To argue that it does not exist is patently untrue, it was this arrogant ignorance of the issues of the working poor that cost us the election in scotland.
    And people like you will cause us to make the same mistakes again.
    We ignore these hard workers at our peril, after all they are the people we are supposed to represent. Hard working people, trying to make a living being attacked by a thatcherite party.

  • Jo K

    I’m not sure who Alex White even is, or how he comes to the conclusion that he speaks for anyone other than himself? But let’s look at his closing remark – a party for many not the few. Well, over the last few weeks we have heard the many speak. Hundreds of thousands of votes, from school crossing patrol staff, home carers, nurses, refuse workers, head teachers, radioigraphers, physiotherapists, senior civil servants and the lowest paid cleaners, all taking the decision to vote for a strike to show that they have had enough. We are striking to defend a pensions deal reached by the last Labour Government, and we expected the Shadow Cabinet to speak out and defend that deal, which so far hasn’t happened. To defend a deal which had mechanisms to ensure affordability into the future in schemes which see billions more being paid in than paid out, meaning that the 3.2% increase in contributions will effectively be a tax on public sector workers, where thousands are losing jobs and seeing pay frozen.

    But even setting aside why it appears so difficult for the Shadow Cabinet to defend a deal they did, let’s look at the strike itself. I work for UNISON, we balloted 1.1m members. Or ‘the many’ as you might say. We didn’t do this on the whim of a General Secretary, we did it because nearly 2000 delegates voted unanimously for a ballot. All of those delegates are public sector workers, who knew all too well what striking would mean. In the ballot, (with a turn out equivalent to most council elections, or does Mr White want to question the legitimacy of Labour Groups?) 250ooo UNISON members voted for strike action. Quarter of a million. Anyone care to remind me what the membership of the party is these days? And we know that in every ballot of this kind, our members will support the action, even if they voted No, even if they didn’t vote, because they want a strong union and they belong to be part of one. And our membership applications are at unprecedented levels – a sign that even those who weren’t in the union support our action.

    And aside from the current pensions dispute, aside from the strike ballot, sometimes this is just about whose side are you on? And our members want to knew whose side the Labour Leadership are on. We have had huge levels of support from Labour parties up and down the country, Labour Groups have voted in support of the trade union members taking action. And against a hostile and vitriolic media and a vicious Government , it is appalling that this author chose to attack us or that Labour List chose to post it.

    Ultimately, we don’t need the support or approval of the Labour Leadership and November 30 will be about 2.5m taking action in defence of pensions and the whole trade union movement uniting against an austerity programme which is devastating lives and damaging the economy. It is an opportunity for the Labour Leader to show whose side he is on, to show support for unions that placed their fait in him and will see silence, ambivalence or opposition as nothing more than a betrayal of that trust

    • Anonymous

      I’m very appreciative of hearing your views Jo,
      especially as you are directly involved and have much experience.

      Wishing you and your colleagues great luck in these difficult times.

      I used to be a member of UNISON,
      and they were utterly professional and very supportive.

      Jo

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Ken-Curran/1527796137 Ken Curran

    I’m sorry Alex takes the view that he does. I would suggest he looks again at Labour’s history and philosophy. Like the Labour Party, the trade union movement isn’t perfect but it does speak on behalf of millions of people, in every community in the country. Trade Unions are democratic organisations, with aims and values shared by the Labour Party.

    My own union, UNISON, is proud of its history, but also proud that it is a modern, forward thinking organisation a million miles from the cliched portrayal of trade unions  in the right wing press. 

    It makes no apologies for standing up for its members, and has called on the Labour Party to give it’s support. To want decent pensions for public sector workers is not an unreasonable position to take, and is part of a wider campaign for decent pensions for all.
    This is something all progressive politicians should support.

    So come on Alex, stand with the many and not the few and join the Union’s campaign for pension justice in the public and the private sector! 

  • Nora

    I challenge Comrade White to come down to his local hospital and tell the UNISON nurses that they should work to 68 and pay more not into their pension scheme but to bail out the banks (average NHS pension £4.5k) 

    remembering that New Labour supported the bankers and refused to introduce equal pay because it might upset the CBI

    You will find that 90% of nurses back the action on wednesday

    Mr white speaks for 30 odd percent

    • Anonymous

      Hi Nora, I can’t see too many frontline staff working until they are 68,
      even if they wanted to- it would be impossible.

      Presumably that’s why police retire in their 50′s, for example.

      But also these jobs take their toll on people’s health; eg back problems,
      stress, physical injuries, and the sheer demands of the roles.

      That has to be factored into the equation.

      Jo

  • http://twitter.com/mmurday87 Binky Murday

    Wow… just wow.

  • Riotsarah
  • http://twitter.com/nwcan Joe Taylor

    It’s because of people like you that working class
    people from families that have voted Labour for generations will never vote
    Labour again.

    • jaime taurosangastre candelas

      Does voting Labour have to be solely heritable?  I’ve voted for four political parties in my lifetime, depending on the issues actually presented at each election and the parties’ capacity to have a sensible answer.  Irrespective of my own views on this matter, it would be foolish for any party to rely on inherited votes.  People are getting much more independent minded as the years go on, and that’s a good thing.

  • Haragu

    Um, Alex, hun? Are you sure you’re in the right Party? I think you might be happier with the other lot.

  • http://twitter.com/matt_j_little Matthew Little

    Reading this article I can’t help but think what Sir Humphrey from yes,minister would say. I think he would call this “very brave”. I think the main problem is that the contempt for the unions is so thinly veiled. There is a case against the strikes from a progressive point of view on the grounds of strategy. To portray this strike action as militant (while I concede that word isn’t use, it’s sentiment is implied), I think is a little erroneous when some of the most “moderate” unions have signed up to strike action.

    Ultimately what we all want is an equitable deal for public sector workers. For this to happen however requires that the public are kept onside. However if it is the democratic mandate of union members that they should strike we should support them. Even if we think the strategy is wrong.

  • http://twitter.com/guvno0or Alex Bee

    Amazing how many people criticise the union for either not having over 50% turnout, or don’t have majority support based on all  possible voters. You don’t tend to hear the same people talking about the PM being an illegitimate leader, even though the majority of the electorate didn’t vote for the conservatives. The number of MP’s, MEP’s, and other political representatives that either didn’t have a majority of the vote or didn’t exceed 50% turnout is pretty shocking, but of course, it’s only the unions that have a problem with turnout and “real” majorities. 

    And Owen Jones is many things, but a socialist-extremist??? That’s just silly.

  • Lisaansell7

    I love this article. How old are you Alex? Read it again at 30!lol There is a phrase ‘the narcissism of small differences’ which sums up the beef between you and Owen Jones. 

  • http://twitter.com/LawrenceShaw Lawrence Shaw

    Fatuous and facile nonsense. Presumably this has been written to drive traffic rather than through any serious conviction.

    To be fair though Labour has never really formally supported any major strike action in its history. In spite of taking on Murdoch who remains the main anti-trade-union pillar of the establishment, the leadership remains curiously embarrassed of its relationship with millions of levy-paying working people.This is no unsupported pay strike by a small group of workers, or some sort deliberate action. It is a defence of the entire ethos of millions of genuinely hard-working people being paid fairly.

    Tactically Labour will miss a trick if it remains ambivalent on the strikes. The action has widespread support from far further than just the “socialist-extremists” and even the worst tabloids are starting to realise this. Crucially it could help bring down this coalition that has no mandate from the electorate whatsoever to engage in the attacks they are now bringing on us.

    Also strike action in itself actually gives power back to individuals. It gives people control back, just for a day, of their lives. 

    And there is a general rule of thumb – those who criticise industrial action are always politically dodgy.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100001102865655 John Ruddy

    Francis Maude will retire with a pension of £43,000 a year.

    We, the ordinary  hard pressed public sector workers are being held to ransom by him. He has a pension few people could even dream of. 

    Now who is right, and who is wrong?

  • http://twitter.com/RidaVaquas Rida Vaquas

    Firstly, in representative democracy whoever has the majority has a mandate, irrespective of turnout. Now we could argue for changes in the way democracy works, but as it works now the unions have a perfectly valid mandate for strikes. And you also contradict yourself, you say they have as much as a mandate for strikes as Tories have for cuts yet you say the electorate voted for the coalition (so they have a mandate). Please clarify what narrative you are maintaining.

    Secondly we are almost totally financially reliant on the unions, so I would say that Labour needs the union several times more than the unions need Labour.

    Thirdly, to me. your argument for modernisation seems to me as an argument for improving communication with the unions. The primaries in France opened up the Parti Socialiste to ordinary people, and the unions are made up of ordinary people. In the fourth quarter of 2010, trade union membership was over six million – that is well over the number of people in Labour. Being closer to trade unions would put power in the hands of the many, by shutting them out we are concentrating power in the hands of the few.

    To argue that there is no working class in Britain is completely absurd, by doing this you are alienating people who work hard and who we claim to represent.

    This is an odd, nonsensical piece.

  • http://twitter.com/hgthorp Howard Thorp

    The trade unions should ditch Labour ASAP

  • http://twitter.com/JossMacDonald Joss MacDonald

    I’d to like a response but I’m just too angry and disappointed with the article to be able to string together even a single sentence.

  • Jonathan Roberts

    I’ve never hidden that I’m on the right of the party.  And I do believe Trade Unions need to modernise, that their leaders don’t always act in the national interest and should have done a much better job in negotiations with the Government.  I disagree with many things that have been said in favour of the strikes…but…

    This is all a little bit much.

    • Anonymous

      Ah I hate to tell you this the leaders of any Union are the members not the officials.

      • Jonathan Roberts

        that’s the spin not the reality.  It is the officials that sit around the meeting table.

        But I’m not being taken down this path…..as I say, the article was a bit strong for me.  Those on strike represent a significant percentage of the workforce, and whilst I don’t agree with everything that has been said by the Unions we all have to respect that their beliefs are heartfelt and deserve the right to have their say.  A right they will exercise on Wednesday.

        • Anonymous

          Unions official do not agree settlements they return to the members that’s not spin that’s fact. For god sake what do you think this is a political party, after 40 years as a Union shop steward convenor and member I can tell  you not once in my time  has negotiation been completed at  a meeting of  employers, government or anywhere else,  it’s only agreed when the membership vote on it.

          • Anonymous

            If that’s the case, why are these Trade Union “leaders” paid quite so much?

          • Anonymous

            Lets see I went to the GMB conference where a wage package was voted on it was accepted and the  official was paid the agreed wage.

            Note it was voted on by the members.

          • Anonymous

            So when Paul Kenny’s salary came up for approval, all 114,000 (in 2009, that is, of which 87k was base salary), you agreed to pay him that much despite the fact that he is effectively a post box for members’ views and apparently (from your post above) makes no decisions?

            You’ll need to explain how that works to me.

    • Anonymous

      1. Trade union officials are employed to represent the interests of their members.
      2. Negotiation is by definition a two-way process and can’t be unilaterally done ‘better’.

  • Gus Baker

    This is genuinely the worst article I’ve ever read on Labour List. 

  • http://twitter.com/yonmei Yonmei

    I’ve been voting Labour for the past few years simply because both my MP and my MSP are solid, hard-working types who do in my view earn their salary and don’t cheat on their expenses. Both of them support unions and support the strike on 30th November. If they’re for me, I’ll vote for them.

    But I find it hard to support the Labour Party when it’s full of privileged little todgers who joined during the glory years of the Blair administration, seeing it as better for their career than the Tories or the LibDems, and now are directing the Labour Party to the right, fearful of the idea that being the Labour party might mean actually standing up for working people, who won’t have the benefit of an MP’s pension on retirement. Who is this Alex Smith and why should we care what he thinks about 30th November?

    I am a UNITE member and, as I don’t work in the public sector and will be unable to be officially on strike on the 30th, I decided not to vote in the ballot. But I do support the strike and the strikers – people who work in the public sector deserve a decent pension. The Tories are trying to damage public sector pensions to make public sector services more suitable for privatisation.

    • http://twitter.com/RF_McCarthy Roger McCarthy

      So did Unite ballot all its members even if they are not in sectors affected by these ‘reforms’?

      If so that might well explain the low turnout…

  • Hugh

    That polling in full: YouGov for the Sunday Times – On the strikes, 50% opposed headteachers taking stike action (38% supported it), 49% opposed teachers taking strike action (41% supported), 51% opposed civil servants taking strike action (39% supported). Turning to Ed Miliband, YouGov asked if people thought he should support or oppose the strikes – 23% think he should support them, 33% oppose them, 27% neither.

    Meanwhile YouGov earlier this month  found people thought public sector workers should pay more into their pensions (by 51% to 35%), agreed with linking pensions to average salary rather than final salary (by 49% to 30%), but just opposed  increasing retirement age (44% thought this was right, 45% wrong).

  • guest

    quite pathetic that you’d publish this, written by someone who-by his own admission-has almost zero credibility on this issue, just to provoke.

    • Anonymous

      We publish posts from across the cross section of the Labour Party. Including (as in this case) when I profoundly disagree with the author. LabourList has always (and will always) cover the whole gamut of Labour Party thought. That will often be un comfortable – but it’s also essential if we are to be representative of such a broad and diverse movement.

      I don’t apologise for posting this article – but I don’t agree with it either.

      • http://twitter.com/reddeviljp jaydeepee

        It’s an indication that you operate no quality control on what’s written . I’ve read some rubbish on this site before but this is the work of a political simpleton.Can anybody write for you then? You don’t appear to be too choosey who does on this evidence.

      • http://profiles.google.com/jrccollier James Collier

        I’m sorry but I would agree with you if this article added anything to the debate, but this is an incredibly thin article, lots of bile very little substance which contains quite personal attacks (poor Owen Jones). Surely by publishing this on labourlist your just showing contempt for the reasoned arguments and interesting points that the right of the party would surely like to put across.

      • Anonymous

        I think I just posted a comment to JDP, but it may have disappeared.

        Jo

      • Redshift

        This isn’t representative of any part of the cross-section…as pointed out above, even those on the Labour right find this offensive

  • http://www.facebook.com/marc.dauncey Marc Dauncey

    Ludicrous. We have a government that was voted in on less than that, in terms of the general population. You should be ashamed of yourself – you aren’t Labour, not really.  What are you for, really? When the biggest political awakening of youth in this country is changing the terms of the debate, what are centre right wonks like you contributing? Bankrupt and irrelevant. Give me a reason to vote for you, not mealy mouthed fence-sitting bullshit like this.

  • http://twitter.com/RF_McCarthy Roger McCarthy

    I was going to just yell Scab! and then retreat but I’ll stick with the image below.

    By some accident you appear to have joined the wrong political party – fortunately there are at least two others that you may find more congenial.  

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100001102865655 John Ruddy

    You joined a different party because some Labour members are idiots? I think you can see from the comments on this article that these views are not those of a majority of party members.

    • http://twitter.com/yonmei Yonmei

       But the fact that Alex White could join the Labour Party and apparently honestly believe that “his party” shouldn’t be dragged into supporting strikes, really says a great deal about how the Labour Party is presenting itself these days and how they’re educating the newer members. Alex White presumably joined hoping to further his career – and the sad thing is, the way the Labour Party seems to be headed, I can see that even this article might.

  • http://www.facebook.com/marc.dauncey Marc Dauncey

    And the piece de resistance – the working class no longer exists. 

    One day you should take a trip to Tottenham, Peckham, Merthyr, Liverpool, Sunderland or any other of the places that once were labour heartlands and see if that’s true. 

    The fact is, people like you gave up on representing the working class. Go join the Tory party.

  • Pingback: In Response to Alex White on November 30th Strikes « Weighing the World

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Mike-Homfray/510980099 Mike Homfray

    What a bizarre post. So, the coalition – not, incidentally, voted for by anyone, should be allowed to do as it pleases?
    And has it not crossed your mind that legal change which Labour failed to reverse have made progress for the unions exceptionally difficult?

    Why exactly did people like you join the Labour Party when you so clearly hate what it is and what it stands for.?

  • http://twitter.com/RF_McCarthy Roger McCarthy

    Thank heaven for all mercies – however small.

    And these would be the very same Greens who are intent on abolishing whole industries and the jobs of the trade unionists who work in them? 

    The same Greens that advocate zero growth policies which if they were by some bizarre brain-fart of the electorate implemented would have exactly the same effect on unemployment as George Osborne’s zero growth policies?

    The Green Party whose website’s top stories are not the impending biggest strike since 1926 and what we can do to support it but: 

    London falling behind on solar panel installations
    Green MEP welcomes European funding for world’s largest off-shore wind farm in Kent

    Long may you continue to enjoy their company….

  • Anonymous

    Gosh, only just discovered this piece.

    I’m sorry to say I disagree profoundly.

    Alex-you paint a false picture of trade union members
    as somehow a minority, and standing outside of the mainstream public.

    I believe the opposite to be true.

    Are you aware of the make up of members, eg health workers in UNISON?

    They are not raving radicals, but ordinary people, often working in the NHS;
    eg ancillary jobs, care assistants, mental health professionals.

    During my career in nursing and health visiting, I was a member of
    RCN, (a professional body;) UNISON,and CPHVA- which I think is affiliated to UNITE.

    These workers and professionals are traditionally moderate and committed people;
    not known to strike or act counterproductively,
    despite all the changes imposed on our organization over the years. 

    In my experience there has always been very good relations and a professional adherence to employment law.The purpose of these unions is to support staff; eg during grievance procedures
    or if issues about sickness/short staffing/management problems etc.

    Reps can act as a go between between worker and employer;
    it is part of the official framework and well respected.

    We might be hearing rhetoric between politicians and union leaders,
    but what goes behind the scenes is far more mundane and normal.

    All workers deserve decent conditions of employment and protection
    from the excesses of some management practices if and when they arise.
    Also- access to information and education which can enhance career development
    and skills.

    I believe this whole scenario is wrong, because it appears to single out one group of workers to pay a very heavy price for something they did not contribute to; also- it is disproportionate in terms of pay scale inequities.

    It’s my understanding that most people who will be more severely affected are older part time women, on relatively lower pay, and likely to have other caring responsbilities.
    How are these not part of the mainstream public?

    We all rely on on and use public services; it keeps society ticking over.
    We are all tax payers, Mums and Dads, or anyone else for that matter.
    It is not about “them and us;” it’s about all of us, involved in one way or another.

    Why shouldn’t Labour be standing on the side of ordinary working people, and those who have committed so much of their working lives to serve others?

    Surely that is what they about; hence the name: Labour.

    As for your comments about the “core working class” etc Alex-
    I’m sorry but I don’t understand.

    Where I live it’s a very mixed area, and I can assure you, probably like most places,
    there are very large pockets of social deprivation.

    I don’t hear much about the lives of these people, or their voices reflected in the media.

    It’s almost as if some people are ignored or sidelined, whereas in the past they might have been factory workers or miners- and perhaps seen as “productive?”
    Now people are struggling to find any kind of jobs or find a satisfying life living on welfare benefits;
    it’s as if a whole chunk of the population has been relegated to the scrap heap.

    I think this is terribly harmful for those people affected, especially families with young children growing up in this enviroment, with little hope or chance for aspiration.

    So yes, this is exactly what I think Labour should be standing up for;
    not just the “squeezed middle!”

    There’s a bit of an obsession about the “middle ground” in my view- as if the population is some homogenous mass.

    They certainly are not- it’s a very mixed picture, and poverty is more prevalant than ever.

    Just wanted to add my views- thankyou.

    Sorry if I’ve sounded a little harsh, but I think you are mistaken in your assumptions Alex.

    Jo

  • Anonymous

    Personally I think people are entitled to express their views, even if provokes disagreement.

    What I believe in strongly though is showing respect towards other writers and posters; so I really dislike Alex’s comments about Owen Jones; it just looks like deliberate provocation.

    On the positive side though- it’s brought out some great contributions on this thread in my opinion; people we don’t normally hear from in the commentary, and I really hope we will hear more from.

    It actually brought out many more Labour minded views for a change!!!

    Thanks, Jo.

  • Anonymous

    Sorry Mark- I’ve just found it.

    Jo

  • http://twitter.com/jayuux jason green

    Alex White, 20 year old University of Kent politics student. That explains it all. Does Mark Ferguson want LabourList to be taken seriously or not?

    • Anonymous

      If that’s the case, then I think it was brave of him to write this article and make a stand, even if provoked disagreement from some.It’s brought out some good stuff too I think.
      It can’t be pleasant to receive a load of negative reactions; at least he made the effort.

      J

      • http://twitter.com/jayuux jason green

        Any politics lecturer  worth their salt would have marked this down as poor for effort. And any editor worth their salt would have asked for  re-write. The ‘article’ is so beneath contempt, that I will not dignify it  by wasting any of my effort by giving it a proper critique.

    • Anonymous

      He’s in training to become a liberal then….another Danny Alexander

  • Pingback: in support of @iamalexwhite « The Right Left

  • Daniel Speight

    I for one – a member of a democratic socialist party…

    I wonder what bits of democratic socialism Alex actually believes in?

    Alex it might be a good idea for you to read a little on the history of the Labour Party. You could start with the formation of the party.

  • Fox1927
  • Redshift

    To think Blairites moan when they get accused of being Tories. This article is exactly why!

    You are regurgitating Tory propaganda about ballots – ignorant of the fact that there is more mandate for this than say most local councillors have and that we have the most restrictive strike laws in Western Europe already. 

    This article shows a complete ignorance to the organisations that to a large extent keep our party financed. There is nothing to gain from expressing the above views unless you are indeed a Tory. To be perfectly honest, if Ed Miliband comes out and makes a defence of the right to strike and the respect that we must have for a DEMOCRATIC ballot, before blaming these strikes on Tory intransigence in the negotiations then he will satisfy most union members that he is on their side without ‘supporting the strike’. It isn’t his decision to make, it is a democratic act – so, I am happy with that line and I’ll be out on the pickets from 7am. 

  • http://www.facebook.com/theDavidBH David ‘dbh’ Braniff-Herbert

    Alex White’s article pretty much sums up the dead ‘new labour’ machine: the idea that individuals careers and popular cliques are more important than involving and supporting politicized working people. 

    This is one of the reasons we lost so much ground. I’m glad this article has been posted, it highlights the massive need for trade union education to new and young members in the Labour Party. I will be contacting TULO to do see what we can do to continue people like Alex White’s vain ignorance. 

    David Braniff-HerbertNational Young Members Rep, GMB

  • http://twitter.com/Spirit_Leveller Spirit Leveller

    Somebody
    ought to remind Alex White and the rest of the ‘Continuity New
    Labour’(CNL) set that the very people they propose to ‘speak for’
    were as singularly unimpressed by their anodyne rhetoric last May as
    socialists within the Labour Party were. There’s a common
    denominator here – the bloodless, insincere, uninspiring, and
    rapidly outmoded ‘solutions’ offered by a group of career
    politicians and career hangers-on who have nothing to offer the
    people of this country but empty bank accounts and empty promises.

    For
    the strongest indicator of just out of touch ‘centrist extremists’
    like Mr White really, you only have to consider his claim that the
    role trade union members play in the “Labour leadership contest
    system is utterly archaic when clearly union members don’t speak
    for the public”. What is so laughable, of course, is White’s
    conspicuously absent reference to the fact that around 250 Labour MPs
    not only dictated and determined who our candidates would be but then
    went on to hold ONE THIRD of the entire vote! Is White seriously
    attempting to suggest that our disproportionately public-schooled,
    Oxbridge educated, £65,000+ earning, publicly discredited
    Parliamentary Labour Party is more representative of the average man
    or woman on the street than even the most deluded of trade-unionists?

     
     
     
     
     
     

  • http://twitter.com/Spirit_Leveller Spirit Leveller

    No, everyone is entitled to justify their opinion. Perhaps, then, you’d like to justify your claim that “strikes are wrong”? I won’t hold my breath.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Peter-Lockhart/793029899 Peter Lockhart

    Labour need Scotland to have any chance of winning power but articles like this are the reason why Labour in Scotland was decimated by the SNP. It the reason why the United Kingdom is in danger of splitting. If  this is the read Labour keep taking then i’m afraid Scotland will stop voting labour completely and if that happens then New Labour Blair acolytes can wail and nash all they like but its only by turning to the left that Labour can win power. We can’t rely on the soft vote of middle England and if we keep pandering to them we’ll lose our core support.

    • Anonymous

      Yes right. Like Labour turning to the Left won which last General Election?

  • David Drinkwater

    Dear Alex

    Just add up how many are in your party (shouln’t take long) and then have a look a the total trade union membership – with so few versus so many are you not being a little pompous.

    Without Union money and membership support it’ll be goodbye to Labour

    p.s I’m a member of the Labour party

  • alex williams

    Bless! Next time save your finger tips and summarise with a one liner like:
    I hate Trade Unions.

    Then we would not waste our time reading what people thought may have been an alternative but reasoned perspective.

  • http://www.facebook.com/elliot.bidgood Elliot Bidgood

    Alex, I agree with your broad sentiments. Ed Miliband was right to take the measured line he is taking on these strikes, as well as one the strikes earlier in the summer, and I am concerned about the sentiments of even many of our more moderate activists on the issue of strikes. The public don’t like strikes, but they do think the government is mishandling the issue, which I believe is in fact the most common-sense reading of this situation. Therefore, Ed is positioning Labour to representing a moderating voice, although I do have a minor concern that the appearance of failing to take a position could still be harmful.

    However, like other commenters, I do have some objections with your specific language about the unions. They are a vital part of our movement, both historically and still today. They are ordinary people, and while it is our obligation as a party to criticise them and distance ourselves when they err, it is equally our obligation to defend their very existance from right-wing attacks. Voting thresholds and 50% standards are considered irrelevant throughout our political system, why should unions be held to a different standard? Why should unions consisting of nurses and shopworkers be considered wholy seperate from “the people”, or excluded from our selection process? I am in favour of further reforms to ensure that their role in our party electoral processes is truly fair, such as clearer restrictions on endorsements to prevent repeats of the Unite/GMB controversy in 2010, but they are already the most statistically underweighted part of the Labour electoral college under the current rules and as paying contributors to our movement they deserve some say. Unions are our strongest financial contributors, and while I believe it is a priority to expand our donor base to decrease our reliance on one source and to increase our overall financial position, even at the height of New Labour they still comprised 60% of our financial base. The fact this has now increased to 85% can only remind us how fickle our other donors, such as those in the City who have now switched to the Tories, will be whenever the going gets tough for the party. While I agree we must always ensure their our partnership with the unions is fair and within the interests of the both the country and the Labour Party, to use a cliche, don’t throw the baby out with the bath water.

  • http://twitter.com/Spirit_Leveller Spirit Leveller

    For some reason, the moderator didn’t let this pass first time. I’m going to hope that it was some sort of glitch:

    So,
    ‘strikes are wrong’ because they inconvenience people. Anyone would
    think the purpose of a strike was for it to pass off without anyone
    noticing!

    Classic
    example of misplaced aggression, I’m afraid. Have you ever thought,
    even for a moment, that if the government gave a hoot about your
    son’s health they wouldn’t have forced ambulance drivers to go on
    strike in the first place by unjustifiably expecting them them to
    work longer and pay more for an inferior pension?

    Frankly,
    it’s embarrassing that you’re incapable of making the mental leap
    between the important role that say, ambulance drivers, play in
    society and why, therefore, they deserve a fair pension in old age. I
    suggest you read the New Economics Foundation’s ‘A Bit Rich’ report on the social
    value of different occupations.

    If
    you’re not convinced by any of these arguments, of course, perhaps
    you’d like to voluntarily give up your weekends, holiday pay, sick
    pay, health and safety legislation, eight-hour day, and, of course,
    most of the welfare state – including the NHS, of course (created
    by a party formed by trade unionists), since all of the concessions
    from the ruling class had to be torn from their greedy, grasping
    hands by trade unionists whose lifetime’s work is being rubbished by
    people like you? Again, I won’t hold my breath.

    As
    an aside, do you not regard it as ironic that you’re an apologist for
    a government of millionaires who are attempting to privatise the very
    health service on which you and your family depend? Talk about a
    Turkeys voting for Christmas…

  • Pingback: Strikes provide Ed with a chance to show responsibility « Alex White

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